[AP Gets it WRONG] Pope Urges Respect for International Law [did NOT "endorse peace movement"]

Zenit ^ | 3-25-2003 | staff

[Notwithstanding]

John Paul II rejected recourse to war as a means to resolve differences -- with the exception of legitimate defense -- and urged respect for humanitarian law in armed conflicts.

"It is precisely when arms are unleashed, that the need becomes imperative for laws that make military operations less inhuman," the Pope said in a message sent to a course for military chaplains, organized by the Holy See in Rome. The course runs today and Wednesday.

The Holy Father's words came at a crucial moment in the development of events in the Anglo-American military operations in Iraq.

The course of formation in humanitarian law, organized jointly by the Congregation for Bishops and the Pontifical Council for Justice and Peace, is being attended by 41 chaplains from all over the world.

The course has been in preparation since 1999, in keeping with the commitment assumed that year by the Holy See during the 37th International Conference of the Red Cross and the Red Crescent.

In his message, the Pope said the principles that constitute international humanitarian law today have been able "to develop thanks to the maturation of principles inherent to the Christian message," particularly the appreciation of the dignity of the human person.

These principles teach that "even in the hardest of battles, it is always possible and, therefore, a duty to respect the dignity of the military adversary, the dignity of civilians, and the indelible dignity of each human being involved in armed conflicts."

"In this way, reconciliation necessary for the re-establishment of peace after the conflict is favored," he added, defending humanitarian law not just as "a juridical code, but above all as an ethical code."

After mentioning the "difficult hour of history, when the world finds itself once again hearing the clash of arms," John Paul II said: "thinking of the victims, the destruction, and the suffering caused by armed conflicts always causes great concern and pain."

"It should be clear by now that war used as an instrument of resolution of conflicts between states was rejected, even before the Charter of the United Nations, by the conscience of the majority of humanity, except in the case of defense against an aggressor," the Pope stressed.

"The vast contemporary movement in favor of peace -- which, according to Vatican Council II, is not reduced to a 'simple absence of war' -- demonstrated this conviction of men of every continent and culture," he added.

In this connection, the Holy Father said that "the strength of different religions in sustaining the search for peace is a reason for comfort and hope."

"In our view of faith, peace, even if it is the result of political accords and understanding among individuals and peoples, is a gift from God that we must constantly invoke with prayer and penance," he said. "Without a conversion of heart, there is no peace! Peace is only achieved through love!"

"Right now we are all asked to work and pray so that war disappears from the horizon of humanity," he concluded.

[k2blader]

That is a prudential question upon which reasonable, good, people can disagree.

I can agree wtih that. However, I think the question of "legitimate defense" can be *credibly* answered only by those equipped with the knowledge to answer it. President Bush, as Commander in Chief, has answered it, and I trust his decision.

I'm not a Catholic, but I respect the Pope.

As a fellow Christian, I'm interested in the specific Biblical basis on which the Pope is founding his statements.

[iranger]

"Yes, and the pope forcefully condemned commnism since his earliest years"

So you'll agree our struggle against the evil of communism has not been bloodless? In fact if we factor in the gulags, Pol Pot, Uncle Fidel, and all the others, the price in blood was high. Perhaps Patton was right, we should have turned right at Berlin and marched straight to Moscow. It would have been cheaper in terms of blood in the long run.

[MEGoody]

"Yours is the religion of the self-important."

As opposed to the religion of the Pope-important?

[MEGoody]

"That is Jesus appointing the first pope."

I'm sure you know that many do not believe that is what Jesus was doing there.

[Nov3]

Pray that the Holy Spirit opens your eyes, fool.

You are a pitiful man who is full of hate.

[Nov3]

I'm not even going to bother replying to you, because if you truly think I'm a leftist, you are so unable to see that no one can possibly straighten you out.

Nobody here thinks you are a leftist. You are obviously a maladjusted fundamenatalist who has some serious issues. I hope and pray you can come to some peace. You have gotten the same results from your faith that Islamic fascists get from theirs.

Good luck and I hope you find Christ.

[Notwithstanding]

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newsletter events chaplain locator » our Shepherd-in-Chief » ask the chaplain military saints » on the issues » recommended resources » care package submit mass intention testimonials » prayers & meditations answering the call to chaplaincy » over there streamed video real audio photos	"Who better than you, dear soldiers and members of the police, young men and women, can testify to the violence and to the disruptive forces of evil present in the world? You fight against them every day: indeed, you are called to defend the weak, to protect the honest, to foster the peaceful coexistence of peoples. The role of the sentinel, who scans the horizon to avert danger and promote justice and peace everywhere, befits each of you.... To each one of you, I express my heartfelt appreciation for your dedication and generous commitment.... Thank you, dear friends, for your courageous work of peacemaking in countries devastated by senseless wars. Thank you for the help you offer, heedless of risks, to people struck by natural disasters. How numerous are the humanitarian missions in which you have been involved in recent years! In carrying out your difficult duty, you frequently find yourselves exposed to dangers and demanding sacrifices. Ensure that all your interventions always cast light on your authentic vocation as 'custodians of the security and freedom of your fellow-countrymen', who 'are contributing to the maintenance of peace', according to the felicitous expression of the Second Vatican Council" - Pope John Paul II Gaudium et spes, n. 79 Excerpt from Homily, Jubilee of the Armed Forces and Police November 19, 2000   THE CATECHISM OF THE CHURCH CCC 2308: All citizens and all governments are obliged to work for the avoidance of war. However, “as long as the danger of war persists and there is no international authority with the necessary competence and power, governments cannot be denied the right of lawful self-defense, once all peace efforts have failed.” (GS 79,4) CCC 2309: The strict conditions for legitimate defense by military force require rigorous consideration. The gravity of such a decision makes it subject to rigorous conditions of moral legitimacy.  At one and the same time: the damage inflicted by the aggressor on the nation or community of nations must be lasting, grave, and certain; all other means of putting an end to it must have been shown to be impractical or ineffective; there must be serious prospects of success; the use of arms must not produce evils and disorders graver than the evil to be eliminated.  The power of modern means of destruction weights very heavily in evaluating this condition. These are the traditional elements enumerated in what is called the “just war” doctrine. CCC 2310: Public authorities, in this case, have the right and duty to impose on citizens the obligations necessary for national defense.  Those who are sworn to serve their country in the armed forces are servants of the security and freedom of nations.  If they carry out their duty honorably, they truly contribute to the common good of the nation and the maintenance of peace. CCC2239: It is the duty of citizens to contribute along with the civil authorities to the good of society in a spirit of truth, justice, solidarity, and freedom. The love and service of one’s country follow from the duty of gratitude and belong to the order of charity. Submission to legitimate authorities and service of the common good require citizens to fulfill their roles in the life of the political community. OTHERS Bishop Fulton Sheen: Where do we get our rights and liberties which we have to defend? They have a source.  Where do I get the right to free speech? Where do you get freedom of conscience, freedom of religion?  If you get them from the state of New York, the State of New York could take them away.  Do you get your rights and liberties from the Federal Government in Washington?  If you got your rights and liberties from the Federal Government in Washington, the Federal Government in Washington could take them away. Our Founding Fathers had to face this question, and it was one of the very first that they answered. The sought for some basis and ground of human rights and liberties, and they found it and set it down in the second paragraph of the Declaration of Independence: It is a self-evident principle that the Creator- the Creator- has endowed man with certain inalienable rights.  They cannot be taken away.  And among them is the right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness USCCB: American Catholic servicemen and women and their chaplains are likewise called conscientiously to fulfill their duty to defend the common good. To risk their own lives in this defense is a great service to our nation and an act of Christian virtue. Terence Cardinal Cooke: Love of our country does not mean forgetting the rest of the world. It does mean thanking God for giving her the strength to sustain those in the world who cannot protect themselves; for giving her the courage to hold fast to principles in a world of profit and loss; for giving her an eagerness to look in new directions in a changing world. Patriotism esteems the generosity to reach out to the poor, the oppressed of the world and to take them into our hearts.  May God make our nation grow in those qualities and lead us to grow with her.	St. Charles Borromeo Church has posted the Catechism of the Catholic Church in it's entirety on-line. The link takes you to the section entitled "Part III: Life in Christ". This is broken down into three sections. The first section (2259-2283) entitled Respect for Human Life, helps to understand how the fifth commandment can be reconciled with legitimate defense. The second section (2284-2301) covers topics that include: respect for the souls of others and respect for the dead. In the final and third section (2302-2330) are the topics of peace and the avoidance of war. Paragraph 2309 specifically refers to the just war doctrine, and paragraph 2310 states: "Those who are sworn to serve their country in the armed forces are servants of the security and freedom of nations. If they carry out their duty honorably, they truly contribute to the common good of the nation and the maintenance of peace." On-line Cathecism The United States Conference of Catholic Bishops also offers the complete Catechism of the Catholic Church on line at www.usccb.org.

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[Notwithstanding]

Apparently it is difficult for you to admit that there was no invasion of the USSR by the USA or any other Western nation - and yet that evil empire disintegrated.

[Notwithstanding]

Bible:

1. God's mercy is inifinite. Imitate God.
2. Turn the other cheek when an injustice is committed upon you.
3. Jesus telling Peter to put his sword down when Peter rises up against an injustice committed against Perfection.

[Notwithstanding]

http://www.catholicjustwar.org/doctrine.asp

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Summary The Just War Doctrine considers two sets of related questions: whether in a particular situation it is morally permissible to resort to war (ius ad bellum); and, if so, what is right conduct within war (ius in bello). Whether force is permitted or even required must be determined affirmatively before considering how it may be used. Historically the threshold question of permission has required: A just cause The decision is to be made by the proper authority with the right intention There must be a reasonable hope of success The expected good will outweigh the expected evil (overall proportionality) War must be the last resort waged for the goal of peace The question of limitation in turn requires: Discrimination; avoidance of direct, intentional harm to noncombatants Proportionality of means; avoidance of needless destruction to achieve justified ends
Catechism "As long as the danger of war persists and there is no international authority with the necessary competence and power, governments cannot be denied the right of lawful self-defense, once all peace efforts have failed." Read from the Catechism on Just War
Other Resources Archbishop Pell of Australia gives reasons both for and against an attack on Iraq, with a coherent exposition of principles, facts, and assessments. Read his article. Noted Scholar, Robert George, gives an interview on Just War and looks at the War on Terrorism.  Read the interview. St. Thomas Aquinas answers objection to war in the Summa Theologica.  Read the Summa on War. War as defined in the Catholic Encyclopedia. Read the Catholic technical definition of war.
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[SoothingDave]

However, “as long as the danger of war persists and there is no international authority with the necessary competence and power, governments cannot be denied the right of lawful self-defense, once all peace efforts have failed.”

I can't think of a competent or powerful international authority, can you?

SD

[Notwithstanding]

The pope - who has HUGE IMPORTANT disagreements with the UN about how they ignore human dignity in many aspects (promoting abortion and contraception and homosexual marriage and adoption as "rights") - still believes the UN can reform and work to achieve "competence".

I don't understand how he could think that to be true, but I am encouraged by his optimism and hope. But I do not share it.

[Notwithstanding]

[iranger]

"Apparently it is difficult for you to admit that there was no invasion of the USSR by the USA or any other Western nation - and yet that evil empire disintegrated."

Admit it? Hell...it was the first thing I stated. See the following...{If you are looking for direct conflict between the USA & USSR, of course there was none.} But I also made the broader point that had there been in 1945, the world would have been the better for it. All I'm saying is walk like a man!

[Notwithstanding]

It will always seem that we played our cards incorrectly at the time.

Who knows what would have happened if we had chosen differently?

[Dumb_Ox]

Noted Scholar, Robert George, gives an interview on Just War and looks at the War on Terrorism. Read the interview.

George is my favorite legal scholar, but this link is broken. Could you fix it?

[Dumb_Ox]

Never mind, I just went to the link: http://www.catholicjustwar.org/doctrine.asp

[laz17]

You are a pitiful man who is full of hate.

Good luck and I hope you find Christ.

Your accusation that I am a fundamentalist proves that you are a New Age Christian, which is to say you are no Christian at all. A watered down fool who struts around mouthing empty platitudes which bring you absolutely no closer to God, and accusing true Christians because they feel the fire and are not the tepid weaklings that you are. Continue pontificating and considering yourself morally superior, which is what vacuous Leftists do.

And no, I am not full of hate. I am full of righteous indignation, and abhorrence of lies and evil. So is God. Will you also accuse Him of being pitiful and full of hate? Claiming I am full of hate further reveals that you are a leftist, because that is the standard charge. "Erase the hate!" Gee, how did you ever fail to call me a rascist as well? You're out of practice, apparently.

It is YOU who is pitiful, and who worship a facsimile of Christ fashioned after the protagonist of "Jesus Christ Superstar". Good luck to you, because you need it far more than I do.

[laz17]

Obviously the truth scandalizes you. That is your problem, not mine. And don't call me a bully. That sounds just like everyone else who is in the wrong who attempts to divert attention from themselves and their wrongness by calling the other a bully. In the same manner that all of America's enemies call herb a bully instead of calling Saddam a dictator.

[laz17]

You insult me and mine. I am off of this thread.

Good. If you can't stand the truth, get off the thread. I live to flush false believers like you into the light like the cockroaches that you are, and show just how spiritually bankrupt you are. If you're a Republican, you must consider switching parties, because the other party is the one that clings to the feel-good false Catholicism of today and is offended when its ears are assaulted by the hard truth. You and your ilk will have a great deal to explain when you stand before the Throne.