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Conservatives, liberals fear broader anti-terror powers - sides unite to protest Justice's push
The Dallas Morning News ^ | April 13, 2003 | By MICHELLE MITTELSTADT / The Dallas Morning News

Posted on 04/13/2003 6:32:28 AM PDT by MeekOneGOP

Conservatives, liberals fear broader anti-terror powers

Sides unite to protest Justice's push to widen Patriot Act's reach

04/13/2003

By MICHELLE MITTELSTADT / The Dallas Morning News

WASHINGTON – Fearful that the Bush administration is poised to ask Congress for greater anti-terrorism powers, including the right to strip Americans of their citizenship, liberals and conservatives are joining forces to block what they view as dangerous encroachments on civil liberties.

The loose-knit coalition was on display last week when conservative activists who otherwise are close administration allies joined the American Civil Liberties Union to decry the Justice Department's impending push for powers that could reach well beyond the USA Patriot Act that Congress raced to adopt in the dark, chaotic weeks after the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks.

The possible outlines of what the Justice Department is seeking in a bill dubbed "Son of Patriot" or "Patriot 2" has had privacy and civil libertarian groups across the political spectrum in an uproar since a draft was leaked in February.

Although Justice Department officials insist the 86-page bill is a preliminary draft that bears little resemblance to what ultimately will be requested, some fear it's a clear sign of things to come.

"Based on past history of various administrations, when draft legislation such as the 'Son of Patriot' that we've been now seeing are first denied and then they surface, where there's smoke there's fire," said former Rep. Bob Barr of Georgia, a conservative Republican who is now an ACLU consultant. "We are very worried that it will surface in some way relatively quickly."

Senate Judiciary Committee Democrats have argued that the Justice Department should work with Congress to draft new anti-terrorism legislation rather than write it in secret.

The leaked draft, stamped "Confidential – Not for Distribution," would grant federal law enforcement sweeping new power to wiretap, detain and punish suspected terrorists while limiting court review and cloaking certain information from the public. Among the most criticized proposals: the right to strip the citizenship of Americans who provide "material" support to organizations designated terrorist groups.

"Everyone is concerned with protecting our people and our society and our homeland," said American Conservative Union Chairman David Keene. "But everyone should be equally concerned at the potential costs to our society and its very nature if we adopt measures that in retrospect would be viewed as unwise."

Justice Department spokesman Mark Corallo declined to discuss which parts of the leaked draft have been discarded and which remain viable.

"We're not going to discuss things that are being deliberated right now," he said. He dismissed criticism that lawmakers are being cut out of the loop, saying Congress ultimately will decide whether to accept, reject or amend the package that will be sent to Capitol Hill later this year.

The Patriot Act has been "an invaluable tool" for terrorism prevention, Mr. Corallo said, adding that he thinks critics have misunderstood the law, which expanded wiretapping and spying authority; lowered prohibitions on the sharing of intelligence with criminal investigators; and imposed restraints on the public release of information.

"The Patriot Act actually strengthened constitutional protections," he said.

That view is far from universally shared.

Librarians in some cities are hastening their routine shredding of patrons' records because of Patriot Act provisions that allow the FBI to review records at libraries, bookstores and other businesses. A California dive shop owner objected when the FBI sought lists of clients at his and other dive shops around the country, citing the possibility that a terrorist diver could launch an attack by slipping unseen into a U.S. port.

And now, groups such as the Eagle Forum and American Conservative Union are setting aside historic policy differences with liberal-leaning organizations such as the ACLU and the Electronic Frontier Foundation to tackle a range of post-Sept. 11 actions they view as threats to freedoms.

"We've given up some civil liberties since 9-11, there is no doubt about it," said Lori Waters, the Eagle Forum's executive director.

Conservative groups historically have left the defense of civil liberties to the ACLU, conservative activist Grover Norquist said. But, he added, "I'm not sure given the Republican control of the House and the Senate and the government that we can count on our left-of-center friends to look out for some of these issues."

The Patriot Act and its possible successor aren't the liberal and conservative groups' only concerns. They fret about a data-mining program known as Total Information Awareness being developed within the Pentagon; an airline passenger profiling system that could roll out later this year; and other proposals.

Ms. Waters and others are voicing particular dismay at reports that Senate Judiciary Committee Chairman Orrin Hatch, R-Utah, with administration backing, wants to make permanent Patriot Act provisions that expire in 2005.

"I am very concerned at the idea of getting rid of the sunsets," Mr. Norquist said.

Mr. Barr, the former congressman, said he viewed the Hatch bid, which apparently has been shelved for now, as an "end-run."

"This is particularly troubling because we have not yet had nearly the full opportunity that we ought to have to see how the Patriot Act is working," Mr. Barr said. "This is a very, very complex piece of legislation."

E-mail mmittelstadt@dallasnews.com


Online at: http://www.dallasnews.com/latestnews/stories/041303dnnatpatriot.41aa0.html


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Front Page News; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections; US: District of Columbia
KEYWORDS: billofrights; patriotact; rights
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To: eno_
I think your #36 was meant for me. I also think you're 100% correct.

They're useless to conservatives not only because they don't do anything but run their faces, but also because they're not conservatives. Every position they take is statist or leftist.

People who hide do it for a reason.

41 posted on 04/13/2003 10:13:29 AM PDT by AAABEST
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To: AAABEST

If the shoe fits, Sacco....

42 posted on 04/13/2003 10:14:02 AM PDT by Cultural Jihad
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To: Roscoe
Yes. We would have the same or better - especially w.r.t. affirmative action - civil right situation without federal intervention.

You are mistaking showcase cases for general progress. The Old South might have been around a little longer, but it would have been just as extinct as it is today.

All that without taking into account the large negative effects of federal civil rights "enforcement." Or do you think the Civil Right Commission hasn't been a negative influence for about three decades - since LBJ - now?
43 posted on 04/13/2003 10:15:15 AM PDT by eno_
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To: Cultural Jihad
You have the 50's and early 60's confused with pre-New Deal America.

As for immigration controls against Nazis and Communists, those never had a negative effect on U.S. citizens, and we should be at least as dilligent about Islamo-fascists.

Would we be freeer with a much-smaller FedGov? What do you think?
44 posted on 04/13/2003 10:18:12 AM PDT by eno_
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To: AAABEST
We conservatives just happen to not agree with you fringe anarcho-ideologue moral-liberals that traffic tickets equate to a 'constitutional crisis.'
45 posted on 04/13/2003 10:18:39 AM PDT by Cultural Jihad
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To: AAABEST
People who hide do it for a reason.

You are demanding that FReepers reveal their identity, yet you rail against the government for wanting to know who terrorists are?

You don't see the irony in this?

46 posted on 04/13/2003 10:19:09 AM PDT by sinkspur
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Comment #47 Removed by Moderator

To: RJCogburn
Shall I also send the wakeup call after the Iraqis use WMDs?

Equating the government of the United States with Saddam's vanishing regime.

Senator John F. Kerry would be proud of you.

48 posted on 04/13/2003 10:22:51 AM PDT by Roscoe
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To: sinkspur
No irony at all. Freeper are proud to be freepers. Look at all the pictures posted of freeps.

Narcs and jackboot lickers, like the Elian Riaders, hide behind masks.
49 posted on 04/13/2003 10:25:12 AM PDT by eno_
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To: Cultural Jihad
Let's re-ban pornography and abortion

Unintended consequences strike again.

50 posted on 04/13/2003 10:26:34 AM PDT by Roscoe
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To: eno_
No irony at all. Freeper are proud to be freepers.

I've been here five years, and nobody has a clue as to who I am. I've read too many horror stories of FReepers who have identified themselves publicly and been harrassed to the point of having to change IPs.

Anyone who identifies themselves in a public forum of any kind is a fool.

51 posted on 04/13/2003 10:29:56 AM PDT by sinkspur
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To: sinkspur
Got any links to horror stories?
52 posted on 04/13/2003 10:35:04 AM PDT by eno_
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To: eno_
Got any links to horror stories?

You've got to be kidding. You want me to tell you about FReepers who've been outed so they can be outed some more?

Why don't you use your real name as your moniker? Got something to hide?

53 posted on 04/13/2003 10:40:23 AM PDT by sinkspur
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To: sinkspur
Why don't you use your real name as your moniker? Got something to hide?

[crickets]

54 posted on 04/13/2003 10:42:32 AM PDT by Roscoe
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To: sinkspur
No, and you are complaining too much. If I were interested in doing something bad to a freeper, I'd Google up those "horror stories" myself - if they existed.

I'm questioning your credibility. How about you cite something?
55 posted on 04/13/2003 10:43:49 AM PDT by eno_
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To: sinkspur
You called his bluff, he folded.

Good call.

56 posted on 04/13/2003 10:45:25 AM PDT by Roscoe
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To: sauropod

Grover Norquist is a helper of terrorist font groups in America!


57 posted on 04/13/2003 10:45:26 AM PDT by TLBSHOW (The gift is to see the truth.....)
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To: Roscoe
I'm not the one advocating for a surveillance state. After you, Alphonse.
58 posted on 04/13/2003 10:46:26 AM PDT by eno_
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To: eno_
Not so surprisingly, the few instances of Nazi-like intimidation tactics I have heard about were all committed by self-avowed libertarians.
59 posted on 04/13/2003 10:46:42 AM PDT by Cultural Jihad
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To: eno_
I'm not the one advocating for a surveillance state.

You were demanding that Freepers reveal their personal information but when called upon to live up to your own words you tucked tail.

No surprise there.

60 posted on 04/13/2003 10:49:17 AM PDT by Roscoe
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