Darth Vader Gargoyle on US National Cathedral [NOT humor!]

http://www.cathedral.org/cathedral/discover/darth.shtml ^ | 4/28/3

[Alkhin]

Re: Thomas Covenant...sadly yes...I subjected myself to that...the author took advantage of people thirsting for more fantasy...I should have put it down after the first chapter...how could I expect to enjoy a quest story about a man whose first act in a strange world is to rape a girl???

It got even worse from there. I gave up on the second book.

I'd recommend The Rule of Life by Benedict of Nursia. He is the father of Western monasticism. His Rule is the basis for many of the monasterial orders. A lot of practical common sense for 'regular folks' as well.

[annyokie]

You've got me beat. I wades halfway through the third one before I decided to use it for a doorstop.


I did my undergrad at a college that was originally a convent and orphanage run by Benedictine Nuns, Order of St. Francis. St. Francis was tad too literal in his interpretation of the Lord's orders, but his is a fascinating story, none the less.

[sharktrager]

Nice try.

You said "I find allegory a pathetic way of telling a story
", tell me where, in that, you say there are any allegories that aren't pathetic?

And no, I don't think I'm Christlike, although I wish I were. I do, however, find that people who make sweeping generalizations usually end up eating their words.

Want a fork?

[Alkhin]

You missed MY point...Christ is the Perfect Story Teller. Any other attempt by anyone else is pathetic. I stand by what I said...allegory is a pathetic way of telling a story. Christ did not say what He did to tell a Story, but to make a point...not for the sake of story telling itself.

Tolkien's point was that if one were to tell a story, the finest stories are told through myth, in which there are underlying concepts. Christ's purpose was to enlighten. Tolkien's purpose was to underscore that enlightenment...not beat people over the head with it.

[Alkhin]

I qualify what I said in my first sentence4 of my last post : Christ was NOT a story teller. To say that about him woudl be to call the Bible a Story. It is not. It is the Word of God.

But allegory is a poor way of telling a story. And that is what many authors do when they write. Tell a story. You're getting Christ's Words confused with the purposes of mythology.

[HairOfTheDog]

I hate Star Wars zealots almost as bad as I hate the LOTR crowd.

But we are so harmless.

[HairOfTheDog]

It's like a mass mind control scenario with that bunch.

Really. Describe the symptoms for me.

[sharktrager]

Allrgory, by definition, is presenting an abstract idea through the use of a story. Hence, by definition, the point of allegory is to "make a point".

[Alkhin]

exactly shark... which has nothing at all to do with Telling A Story. And there would be verifiable truth in Christ's use of story. In Tolkien's view, allegory has no place in telling A Story, especially when it involves archetypes which point to truth.

You seek to thrash me as an anti-Christian because I despise allegory. Christ's words are Truth, saying allegory is how to describe His words is to demean his words. Tolkien disputed Lewis' advocacy of allegory for his own reasons. I am not sure you are familiar with that.

As such, you are spoiling for a rumble. The trash you tried to throw on me for speaking my thoughts on allegory is beyond the pale. Go back to your little focus group.

[Republicanus_Tyrannus]

Touche' -- great comeback.


But you're wrong.


Hehehehe.

[HairOfTheDog]

Doesn't mean I have to share in their idol worship.

Who worships what idol?

You sound bitter and mean. And since I declared earlier this month that you are a good guy, I find it important to clear up this question:

WHAT IS YOUR PROBLEM?

[Jhoffa_]

You sound bitter and mean.

"Shut-up!

Get off my lawn!"

(That's bitter and mean.. I am more like smarmy and arrogant)

[HairOfTheDog]

OK - so answer the other questions!

[Jhoffa_]

Really. Describe the symptoms for me.

Abraded knees, LOTR head chips, lockstep mentality, safety blankets embroidered with images of Frodo.

[HairOfTheDog]

Who has any of that?

[Jhoffa_]

Who has any of that?

Why, the same people who have these, of course..

(Even a costume, so you can dress your kid like a hobbit to gurantee he will be summarily gay-bashed.. Only $26.95)

There are also life size carboard images, stationary, key fobs, pen & pencil sets, banners & flags as well as various articles of clothing and about a thousand other things that are too numerous and bizarre to mention here..

I guess I'm just getting:

[HairOfTheDog]

That stuff is hilarious, not worshipping, but I don't know anyone who HAS any of it.

[Jhoffa_]

...she blushed.

[HairOfTheDog]

Who do you know that has any of this crap? - The pins look home-made, and their humor obviously escapes you.

I do know some people who read the lampoon book.

So what? - Who is it that is bothering you so much? - Do you really feel taken over by Tolkien fans with Frodo shirts? I have never seen one, and I hang out with Tolkien lovers.

[Jhoffa_]

So what? - Who is it that is bothering you so much?

Remember, i'm not the one posting rapid fire questions to you dear..

I just made a one line comment and then the fruitcake brigade took the rest of this on themselves.