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Right-Wing Party Threatens To Abolish Belgium
The Daily Telegraph ^ | May 17, 2003 | Ambrose Evans-Pritchard

Posted on 05/16/2003 5:24:05 PM PDT by bruinbirdman

French-speaking enemies call him a "designer fascist", with his air of having just stepped off a plane from San Francisco.

Filip Dewinter, the strongman of the Vlaams Blok, the Right-wing anti-immigration party that is poised to do well in tomorrow's Belgian election, is a man who provokes that sort of angry reaction.

His Flemish front poses a mortal threat to the Belgian state and the welfare apparatus that keeps the French-speaking regions afloat.


Filip Dewinter

Each year, the Dutch-speaking majority in the north pay a bigger share of GDP to subsidise their former masters in Wallonia than the west Germans transfer to their cousins in the eastern Lander.

Mr Dewinter intends to put a stop to this by abolishing Belgium, which was created by Lord Palmerston in the early 1830s, against the wishes of both tribes. He wants to carve out an independent Flemish state which he says should be aligned with the "Anglo-Saxon world".

The Blok has risen so far, so fast, from its murky origins in Waffen SS nostalgia that it could become the biggest Flemish party in tomorrow's election, shattering the cosy coalitions that have run Belgium for half a century and slavishly followed Paris in European Union politics. The Blok already has 33 per cent of the vote in the Flemish bastion of Antwerp.

At a Blok "family day" in rural Limburg, 2,000 beer-drinkers - Antwerp dockers and Phillips workers from the factory in nearby Hasselt - gathered in the rain waving the party banner, "Eigen Volk Eerst"(Our People First). A speaker wound up the crowd with a stream of insults about Elio Di Rupo, the bow-tied, openly homosexual Walloon leader.

Mr Dewinter praised President George W Bush for dealing with Saddam Hussein and told me in good English: "The chief threat to the world now is radical Islam. They were taught a lesson by the Iraq war that they must take the West seriously. They thought we were very soft and tolerant but they now see we can hit back when necessary."

Like neighbouring Rotterdam, power base of the murdered Dutch populist Pim Fortuyn, Mr Dewinter's home town, Antwerp, has become a multicultural powder keg, a recruiting centre for al-Qa'eda.

Last year, a former Hizbollah fighter from Lebanon, Abou Jahjah, led race riots that charged through the shopping district, allegedly smashing the windows of those who failed to pay protection money.

Children of ultra-orthodox Jews are preyed upon by North African gangs on their way to school and now have to walk in groups.

"We are seeing the first pogroms in Belgium since World War Two," Mr Dewinter said.

"How can this be happening in a democratic country? We've got the most Left-wing citizenship laws in Europe that lets people have nationality after three years, even if they come illegally.

"What the Labour Party has been doing in England is to the point. We've got to stop non-European immigrants coming in from the Third World. Those who are already here should have to assimilate or go back."

For the Blok, mass immigration means more Algerians or Moroccans who speak French and gravitate into the "enemy" camp.

It is hard to separate the language war from the questions of race.

So where does the Blok fit on the Right-wing spectrum that runs from Germany's skinheads, to Jean-Marie Le Pen's anti-semitic Front National, to sleek "post-fascists" such as Italy's Alleanza Nazionale, to Fortuyn's gay, feminist, free-market, anti-Muslim mish-mash?

Most Flemish nationalists welcomed the Nazis as liberators in 1940, believing Hitler would create a Flemish state. Thousands volunteered for SS divisions to fight Bolshevism on the Eastern Front. The state later sentenced 2,940 to death for treachery, imprisoned 70,000 and charged 405,000 with collaboration, punishing five per cent of all Belgians. The Vlaams Blok, founded in 1978, is led by their children.

Perhaps a ruling elite that has still not put Marc Dutroux on trial - for fear of what he might reveal - seven years after he starved young girls to death in chains in his dungeons, should ask itself why the Vlaams Blok is running away with the votes.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs; Front Page News; Government; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: belgium; conservative; dutch; eu; europeanunion; flemish; french; immigration; rustleinbrussels; vlaamsblok
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1 posted on 05/16/2003 5:24:05 PM PDT by bruinbirdman
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To: bruinbirdman
Right-Wing Party Threatens to Abolish Belgium

That's a platform we can all endorse!

2 posted on 05/16/2003 5:28:42 PM PDT by Loyalist (Keeper of the Schismatic Orc Ping List. Freepmail me if you want on or off it.)
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To: Loyalist
Uh, where do I enlist?
3 posted on 05/16/2003 5:37:30 PM PDT by Ursus arctos horribilis ("It is better to die on your feet than to live on your knees!" Emiliano Zapata 1879-1919)
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To: bruinbirdman
This article is filled with so many one-liners.

French-speaking enemies call him a "designer fascist", with his air of having just stepped off a plane from San Francisco.

That would be "gayly tripped off a plane from San Francisco".

Each year, the Dutch-speaking majority in the north pay a bigger share of GDP to subsidise their former masters in Wallonia than the west Germans transfer to their cousins in the eastern Lander.

So the Walloons pay more money than West Germans did to repatriot East Germans?

The Blok has risen so far, so fast, from its murky origins in Waffen SS nostalgia that it could become the biggest Flemish party in tomorrow's election, shattering the cosy coalitions that have run Belgium for half a century and slavishly followed Paris in European Union politics.

Okay, so Blok is bad, it had it's origins in the Waffen SS nostalgia, even though it is against anti-semitism and further Muslim immigration. Maybe that is the real crime.

Perhaps a ruling elite that has still not put Marc Dutroux on trial - for fear of what he might reveal - seven years after he starved young girls to death in chains in his dungeons, should ask itself why the Vlaams Blok is running away with the votes.

Is it just possible that there are decent Belgians that are waking up?

4 posted on 05/16/2003 5:37:35 PM PDT by xJones
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To: bruinbirdman
Ambrose Evans-Pritchard, whose work I respect, takes a petty tough anti-Nazi line here. I suspect that the history of the Flemish region was like much of the rest of Europe: caught between the Nazis on one side and the Bolsheviks on the other. Damned if you do, and damned if you don't.

The Communists were on the winning side, since Roosevelt and Stalin decided to ally themselves with Stalin; and many Flemish partisans were executed after the war. I'm not sure they were any worse than the Communists.

In any case, that's water over the dam. Why should the Flemish be forced to pay taxes to support the people who have been persecuting them? Why should the children of Nazis continue to be vilified, while children of Communists and even present-day Communists are automatically absolved of their guilt?
5 posted on 05/16/2003 5:37:36 PM PDT by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
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To: bruinbirdman
This is an excellent develoment, but we need to speak out against such parties and politicians from being branded as "fascist" - they are patriotic populists who are keenly aware of the threat from Muslims. The Muslim populations in small European nations are already a massive threat, many terrorist leaders from Hizbollah, al-Qaeda etc are among them and supported by the local Islamists. Race riots, gang wars, terrorizing of the locals, gang rapes of white women...the list goes on and is virtually unbelieveable.
6 posted on 05/16/2003 5:39:23 PM PDT by lib-r-teri-ann
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To: Loyalist
To use a trite and hackneyed phrase: "Sounds like a plan".
7 posted on 05/16/2003 5:39:34 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: HairOfTheDog; Overtaxed
"Most gratuituous use of "Belgium" in a screenplay award" ping.
8 posted on 05/16/2003 5:41:49 PM PDT by JenB (42)
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Comment #9 Removed by Moderator

To: bruinbirdman
Perhaps a ruling elite that has still not put Marc Dutroux on trial - for fear of what he might reveal

This is a surprise! I remember the shock that went through Belgium at the time -- that this could happen here! But that he's not only not (French) toast, but not even put on trial... what might he reveal?????

10 posted on 05/16/2003 5:46:17 PM PDT by Eala ("We don't see it as a 'quota', we see it as a 'performance standard'")
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To: FreepShop
Jews in Antwerp should arm themselves and take care of any Muslim marauders.

Not likely to happen, if a recent visit with a Jewish classmate of the wife's, still living in Antwerp, is any indication.

11 posted on 05/16/2003 5:48:51 PM PDT by Eala ("We don't see it as a 'quota', we see it as a 'performance standard'")
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To: bruinbirdman
And, uh Belgium is important..... why?
12 posted on 05/16/2003 5:51:12 PM PDT by pipecorp (If they pull the great electronic plug, where will all the ones and zeros go?)
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To: bruinbirdman
He wants to carve out an independent Flemish state which he says should be aligned with the "Anglo-Saxon world".

Make it so.

13 posted on 05/16/2003 5:51:33 PM PDT by RightWhale (Theorems link concepts; proofs establish links)
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To: bruinbirdman
The Blok has risen so far, so fast, from its murky origins in Waffen SS nostalgia...
...
Most Flemish nationalists welcomed the Nazis as liberators in 1940, believing Hitler would create a Flemish state.

The NYT oughtta hire this guy; he sounds like one of theirs. Talk about prejudice, slanted reported and naked, raw bias...

14 posted on 05/16/2003 5:52:23 PM PDT by Eala ("We don't see it as a 'quota', we see it as a 'performance standard'")
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To: bruinbirdman
So if they do elect this character, what happens, a reprise of the Jorg Haider affair, wherein Austrians learned what sort of government the EU would not permit them to have?
15 posted on 05/16/2003 5:53:09 PM PDT by Billthedrill
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To: bruinbirdman
I'm charmed by the idea of abolishing Belgium. I never saw the point of it to begin with.
16 posted on 05/16/2003 5:53:17 PM PDT by The_Reader_David
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To: Stingray51
bump
17 posted on 05/16/2003 5:54:02 PM PDT by Rodney King (No, we can't all just get along.)
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To: JenB
Maybe french canada, french belgium and francis
will join to make a large turd world country.
18 posted on 05/16/2003 5:54:15 PM PDT by HuntsvilleTxVeteran (CCCP = clinton, chiraq, chretien, and putin = stalin wannabes (moore is goebbels))
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To: bruinbirdman
"How can this be happening in a democratic country? We've got the most Left-wing citizenship laws in Europe that lets people have nationality after three years, even if they come illegally

He answered his own question, LOL, Europe is sure a wierd place, no wonder so many leave the continent.

19 posted on 05/16/2003 5:55:56 PM PDT by Mister Baredog ((They wanted to kill 50,000 of us on 9/11, we will never forget!))
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To: Eala
Well at least I know where I'm movin when hillary becomes the President... LOL.
20 posted on 05/16/2003 5:56:37 PM PDT by freethinkingman
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To: Cicero
Ambrose Evans-Pritchard, whose work I respect, takes a petty tough anti-Nazi line here. I suspect that the history of the Flemish region was like much of the rest of Europe: caught between the Nazis on one side and the Bolsheviks on the other. Damned if you do, and damned if you don't.

There were some hard core Nazi's in Belgium who were Flemish. However, there were Nazi Walloons as well. The Waloonian (sp?) Leon Degrelle is one of the most famous non-German Nazis. He was temorarily the head of Nazi occupied Beligum for a the few weeks after the start of the Battle of The Bulge.

Yes, the Flemings were more welcoming to the Nazi's then the Walloons were overall, but there is a good reason for that. The Walloons had always oppressed the Flemish. The Walloos did not allow them to have Flemish schools, etc. During World War I, the Germans allowed the Flemish to have their owns schools, local governments, etc. Of course, when World War I was over, the Walloons went right back to oppressing the Flemish. So, it's no surprise that when the Germans came back in 1940 many Flemings weren't too upset about it.

But that's the extent of it. Otherwise, this is just the usual Nazi slur.

21 posted on 05/16/2003 5:58:56 PM PDT by Rodney King (No, we can't all just get along.)
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To: Cicero
Ambrose Evans-Pritchard, whose work I respect

Cicero, your comments/posting speak for you. I don't know this guy, but knowing the Flemish (I work with a couple of colleagues, the wife grew up in Antwerp, and we spend time there when possible) I find the tone here offensive. What is different here?

22 posted on 05/16/2003 5:58:58 PM PDT by Eala ("We don't see it as a 'quota', we see it as a 'performance standard'")
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To: freethinkingman
Well at least I know where I'm movin when hillary becomes the President... LOL.

I'd actually considered it. I like Antwerp. (I don't speak Vlaams, but that can be rectified.) But a (native) friend there advised against it. OTOH, should it become part of a Flemish state, *that* would be different.

23 posted on 05/16/2003 6:04:18 PM PDT by Eala ("We don't see it as a 'quota', we see it as a 'performance standard'")
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To: bruinbirdman
From the CIA Factbook:

Belgium became independent from the Netherlands in 1830 and was occupied by Germany during World Wars I and II. It has prospered in the past half century as a modern, technologically advanced European state and member of NATO and the EU. Tensions between the Dutch-speaking Flemings of the north and the French-speaking Walloons of the south have led in recent years to constitutional amendments granting these regions formal recognition and autonomy. Fleming 58%, Walloon 31%, mixed or other 11%

Roman Catholic 75%, Protestant or other 25%

Dutch (official) 60%, French (official) 40%, German (official) less than 1%, legally bilingual (Dutch and French)

24 posted on 05/16/2003 6:08:20 PM PDT by Gritty
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To: bruinbirdman
Quote of the Day by Free ThinkerNY
25 posted on 05/16/2003 6:09:31 PM PDT by RJayneJ
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To: Cicero
I lived in Belgium from 1995-1998, during the Dutroux affair. Politics in the "nation" are very complicated, and as in most of Europe, history is quite a burden. I knew Walloons who told me that all the Flemings had collaborated with the Nazis; it was true that there were many more monuments to the US Army in Waloonia (Bastogne and a number of well-tended cemetaries) than in Flanders. On the other hand, a die hard group of SS Nazi Walloons were the last Nazi defenders of the Reichstag. The Flemings have some legitimate grips about Walloon domination, and the (gay) Walloon politician mentioned in the article was named in the Dutroux affair, but still holds power. I did, however, find the Blok campaign literature to be offensive (I was a "guest worker" myself, and some of the gross cartoons they criculated could be taken as threatening against foreigners). Belgium's real problem is just what the article implied, it is an artificial nation that was meant to be a buffer between Germany and France; maybe that's what makes Brussels the perfect "Capital of Europe".
26 posted on 05/16/2003 6:10:05 PM PDT by Martin Tell
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To: bruinbirdman
The Blok has risen so far, so fast, from its murky origins in Waffen SS nostalgia...

Translation: Someone found a picture of Dewinter at age 7, wearing an SS uniform on Halloween.

27 posted on 05/16/2003 6:13:09 PM PDT by Timesink
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To: Eala
Ambrose Evans-Pritchard wrote one of the early exposes of the Toon, "The Secret Life Of Bill Clinton". He might even have freeped before he went back to the UK.

yitbos

28 posted on 05/16/2003 6:21:36 PM PDT by bruinbirdman (Anyone remember the DITHF hoax?)
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To: bruinbirdman
No wonder this guy is popular, he has the right ideas. But what's that crack about San Francisco, are they trying to intimate he's gay? They're saying he's like a "gay nazi"? If he's gay then the liberal, left-wingers should like him.
29 posted on 05/16/2003 6:22:23 PM PDT by Contra
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To: Gritty
Henri Pirenne, famous Belgian historian, rationalized Belgium's existence by claiming that Belgium's historical roots lie in 'Lotharingia'(sp?), the rump of Lothair's portion of his Grampa Charlemagne's Empire.

Pretty thin stuff, actually. Belgium's a place for the Germans to water their horses on the way to France.

And for Canadians to die driving the Germans home.
30 posted on 05/16/2003 6:41:50 PM PDT by headsonpikes
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To: Dark Wing
ping
31 posted on 05/16/2003 6:58:12 PM PDT by Thud
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To: xJones
So the Walloons pay more money than West Germans did to repatriot East Germans?

Actually the Walloons are the French speaking minority in the south. The folks paying too much (more than west Germans pay to subsidize east Germans) are the Flemish.

My biggest problem with this is the smarmy insinuation that the Flemish Belgians welcomed the Nazi's. My wife's step mother was 16 when the Nazi's conquered her small town in north central Belgium (Flanders). She tells stories of risking being executed by saving her sugar rations to pour into the German's staff cars. They didn't welcome the Germans, they just had no choice because their masters (the Walloons) had followed the post World War 1 pacifist policies of most of Europe.

Belgium as a country is a joke. Every Belgian school child, French speaking Walloon or Flemish speaking Flander, learns both languages in school as a requirement of graduation. They each then refuse to acknowledge that they know the "other" language for the rest of their lives. That's why most business in Belgium, at least between Flemish and Walloons, is conducted in English.

An independent Flanders would be a feisty little addition to the mix in the EU. Their favorite symbols are the Manika Piss (little boy pissing, famous fountain in Brussells) and the Confederate battle flag.

32 posted on 05/16/2003 7:00:37 PM PDT by Phsstpok
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To: bruinbirdman
I remember hearing that Dr. Evil was taught to be evil by a Belgian couple in the third Austin Power's movie,"Goldmember."
33 posted on 05/16/2003 7:03:22 PM PDT by Captain Shady
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To: bruinbirdman
Perhaps a ruling elite that has still not put Marc Dutroux on trial - for fear of what he might reveal - seven years after he starved young girls to death in chains in his dungeons, should ask itself why the Vlaams Blok is running away with the votes.

I should have known the pedophocracy spoke French.

34 posted on 05/16/2003 7:21:08 PM PDT by xm177e2 (Stalinists, Maoists, Ba'athists, Pacifists: Why are they always on the same side?)
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To: xm177e2
CrimeLibrary.com/Serial Killers/Sexual Predators/Marc Dutroux

yitbos

35 posted on 05/16/2003 7:41:47 PM PDT by bruinbirdman (Anyone remember the DITHF hoax?)
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To: bruinbirdman
I wonder if having their Embassy bombed by the Muslims will have an effect on the election?
36 posted on 05/16/2003 8:18:37 PM PDT by Mike Darancette (Soddom has left the bunker.)
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To: Loyalist
If successful, would anybody notice?
37 posted on 05/16/2003 8:21:06 PM PDT by 11th Earl of Mar
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To: headsonpikes
Actually, Lotharingia is named for Lothair II (855-869), son of Lothair I (emperor and ruler of the Middle Kingdom, 840-855). Lothair I was a son of Louis the Pious and a grandson of Charlemagne.

Belgium exists because the Spanish armies in the 16th century were able to control the southern provinces but not to subdue the northern provinces, which became the independent Netherlands. The southern provinces were the Spanish Netherlands until 1713, then handed over to Austria. They were conquered by the French during the Revolutionary period. After the defeat of Napoleon, Belgium was added to the Kingdom of the Netherlands (the idea being to strengthen the countries on France's borders) but the Belgians were dissatisfied and rebelled against Dutch rule in 1830. That led to the creation of an independent Belgium.

Winston Churchill was critical of the Belgian government during the months before the German attack in 1940--they refused to allow French and British armies to enter the country in anticipation of the German attack that they knew was coming: "the Belgian King and his Army staff merely waited, hoping that all would turn out well." Had the French and British troops been in Belgium, the German invasion would have been much more difficult to execute.

Belgium last had historic significance in the 1988 election, when Michael Dukakis made Belgian endive a campaign issue.

38 posted on 05/16/2003 8:30:23 PM PDT by Verginius Rufus
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To: bruinbirdman; section9; Dog Gone; blam; JohnHuang2
No tin foil, just remembering what happened in Holland; the Left will murder DeWinter if it appears that he will be able to turn politics against them.
39 posted on 05/16/2003 8:41:02 PM PDT by Southack (Media bias means that Castro won't be punished for Cuban war crimes against Black Angolans in Africa)
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To: Southack
Pim Fortune?
40 posted on 05/16/2003 8:41:41 PM PDT by Southack (Media bias means that Castro won't be punished for Cuban war crimes against Black Angolans in Africa)
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To: Southack
just remembering what happened in Holland; the Left will murder DeWinter

"EU sanctions were imposed because Austria’s EU partners doubt the far right’s commitment to democracy and respect for human rights."

41 posted on 05/16/2003 9:00:54 PM PDT by bruinbirdman (Anyone remember the DITHF hoax?)
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To: Southack
...the Left will murder DeWinter if it appears that he will be able to turn politics against them.

My thoughts exactly. He'll take a bullet within a year.

42 posted on 05/16/2003 9:19:35 PM PDT by randog (It's always darkest before the dawn--a good time to steal the neighbor's newspaper.)
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To: Southack
That is why he is being called a Nazi. They're setting him up just as Pim Fortuyn was set up. National elections in some Western European countries are being determined by assassination just as happened in Japan between World Wars One and Two.

Democracy it isn't. Anyone who looks like successfully deviating from the script is murdered.

43 posted on 05/16/2003 9:30:42 PM PDT by Thud
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To: bruinbirdman
He's Dewinter of their discontent.
44 posted on 05/16/2003 9:37:44 PM PDT by Consort
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Ah, the traditional misuse of the word "Fascist" by the Left continues. Leftists are quick to smear Rightists with wildly inaccurate allegations, but Heaven forbid that a Leftist ever rightly be called a Communist! Heaven forbid that adherents of the most murderous idealogy in modern history be identified as such! So it always goes. Rightist politicians and statesmen are invariably smeared as "Fascists" and such, even when the identification is plainly nonsensical.

Alexander Hamilton had something to say about those men that have overturned the liberties of republics -- that the greater part have begun by paying an obseqious court to the people, commencing demagogues, and ending tyrants. The Left, with its empty talk of hollow ideals, is a far more insidious and deadly foe to true liberty than the Right could ever be. Remember, the Jacobins -- the Terrorists of Revolutionary France, the Dantons, the Robespierres, the Saint-Justs -- spoke only of Liberty, Equality, and Fraternity.
45 posted on 05/16/2003 11:46:18 PM PDT by Citizen of the United States (Veritas Vos Liberabit)
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To: bruinbirdman
bump
46 posted on 05/17/2003 3:41:57 AM PDT by RippleFire
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To: bruinbirdman
The Blok sounds like an anglo-focused conservative group that opposes anti-semitism and illegal immigration.

The above makes it impossible for them to be "fascist." Fascist is now the word of choice for initially "slamming" anyone with a conservative worldview. Since most western conservatives are also strongly democratic, then it is impossible for them to be socialists.

Since fascists were socialists, then it only follows that the true heir to the fascist label would be the socialist parties of Belgium and France where anti-semitism is practiced. Now THAT does sound like socialism.

47 posted on 05/17/2003 4:20:55 AM PDT by RockBassCreek
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To: bruinbirdman
The French (Walloon) minority is dominating the Dutch (Flemish) majority with the help of the EU and Paris. They're going to flood the country with French-speaking immigrants to support the French minority.

Reminds me of Canada where a French-speaking minority has seized the government and of the Dimocrat strategy for open borders here in Amcerica. Very similar, very French.

Loathsome frogs.
48 posted on 05/17/2003 6:27:29 AM PDT by George W. Bush
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To: Verginius Rufus
Thanks for your correction and amplification.

49 posted on 05/17/2003 8:04:47 AM PDT by headsonpikes
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To: bruinbirdman
The Vlaams Blok scored big gains, but unfortunately Belgium's leftist coalition retains its majority: Belgium makes election decision.
50 posted on 05/18/2003 2:49:53 PM PDT by aristeides
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