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To: Gargantua
That fact alone gives lie to the neo-liberal-concept of "Separation of Church and State" as it is abused today, and gives truth to America's having been founded as a Christian nation.

Sorry. "That fact alone" conveniently ignores that Jefferson was a Deist, not a Christian, and that one of the achievements he asked to have on his gravestone was authorship of Virginia's Statute of Religious Freedom, which says in part:

WE the General Assembly of Virginia do enact that no man shall be compelled to frequent or support any religious worship, place, or ministry whatsoever, nor shall be enforced, restrained, molested, or burthened in his body or goods, nor shall otherwise suffer, on account of his religious opinions or belief; but that all men shall be free to profess, and by argument to maintain, their opinions in matters of religion, and that the same shall in no wise diminish, enlarge, or affect their civil rights.

While many of the Founders were Christians, they didn't establish a Christian nation, or a Judeo-Christian nation or anything of the sort.

They established a FREE nation.

54 posted on 05/20/2003 10:19:57 AM PDT by jimt
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To: jimt
Argue all you want, but America was founded as a Christian nation. Every State in the Union had an Official State Religion at the time when our Constitution was penned.

Whether they were Congregational, Baptist, Lutheran, or other, they were all Christian. Every single State.

Both houses of our Congress open every session with prayer from a Chaplain. Always have. Since their inception.

For centuries, every Court in our nation had every person giving testimony at trial only after having sworn an oath on the Bible.

Our very curreny tells us "IN GOD WE TRUST." Not Buddah. Not Allah. Not Krishna.

GOD. As found where? In the Bible.

And, George Washington (you know, the "Father of America") created the Holiday (Holy Day) of Thanksgiving at the joint request of both the House and the Senate, saying this:

George Washington’s Thanksgiving Proclamation.

"Whereas it is the duty of all nations to acknowledge the providence of Almighty God, to obey His will, to be grateful for His benefits, and humbly to implore His protection and favor; and Whereas both Houses of Congress have, by their joint committee, requested me "to recommend to the people of the United States a day of public thanksgiving and prayer, to be observed by acknowledging with grateful hearts the many and signal favors of Almighty God, especially by affording them an opportunity peaceably to establish a form of government for their safety and happiness:"

"Now, therefore, I do recommend and assign Thursday, the 26th day of November next, to be devoted by the people of these States to the service of that great and glorious Being who is the beneficent author of all the good that was, that is, or that will be; that we may then all unite in rendering unto Him our sincere and humble thanks for His kind care and protection of the people of this country previous to their becoming a nation; for the signal and manifold mercies and the favorable interpositions of His providence in the course and conclusion of the late war; for the great degree of tranquility, union, and plenty which we have since enjoyed; for the peaceable and rational manner in which we have been enable to establish constitutions of government for our safety and happiness, and particularly the national one now lately instituted' for the civil and religious liberty with which we are blessed, and the means we have of acquiring and diffusing useful knowledge; and, in general, for all the great and various favors which He has been pleased to confer upon us."

"And also that we may then unite in most humbly offering our prayers and supplications to the great Lord and Ruler of Nations and beseech Him to pardon our national and other transgressions; to enable us all, whether in public or private stations, to perform our several and relative duties properly and punctually; to render our National Government a blessing to all the people by constantly being a Government of wise, just, and constitutional laws, discreetly and faithfully executed and obeyed; to protect and guide all sovereigns and nations (especially such as have show kindness to us), and to bless them with good governments, peace, and concord; to promote the knowledge and practice of true religion and virtue, and the increase of science among them and us; and, generally to grant unto all mankind such a degree of temporal prosperity as He alone knows to be best."

Given under my hand, at the city of New York, the 3d dy of October, A.D. 1789.

(signed) G. Washington

The longest-living Founding Father was John Quincy Adams. As such, he was a much sought after speaker for patriotic events. On July 4, 1837, he made a very astute observation. He said:

"Why is it that, next to the birthday of the Savior of the world, your most joyous and most venerated festival returns on this day? Is it not that, in the chain of human events, the birthday of the nation is indissolubly linked with the birthday of the Savior? That it forms a leading event in the Progress of the Gospel dispensation? Is it not that the Declaration of Independence first organized the social compact on the foundation of the Redeemer's mission upon earth?"

"That it laid the cornerstone of human government upon the first precepts of Christianity and gave to the world the first irrevocable pledge of the fulfillment of the prophecies announced directly from Heaven at the birth of the Savior and predicted by the greatest of the Hebrew prophets 600 years before?"

Sound 'Christian' to you? Yeah, me too.

Tilt at windmills 'til you're blue in the face, it won't change the fact that America was founded as a Christian Nation.

58 posted on 05/20/2003 11:21:06 AM PDT by Gargantua (Embrace clarity.)
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To: jimt; Gargantua; TonyRo76
Jefferson was a Deist, not a Christian

Liberals, who want to purge Christianity from our history, have floated this as a fact while it is true only in the very limited sense that Jefferson did not believe in the Nicene creed.

Throughout history, many who consider themselves Christian have not subscribed to the creed (which is why it was written in the first place).

Jefferson was what was first called a dissenter and then became the Unitarian church. Unitarianism evolved from the Arian heresy of the 4th century. It is a Christian heresy and those who believe in it are Christian heretics, not believers in Ganesha, Ahura Mazdah or some vague diety. The believe in the God of the Old and New Testament. Jefferson, Franklin, John & Abigail Adams, Millard Filmore, William Channing, Joseph Priestley were all Unitarians "dissenters of one flavor or another.

A few deists were around at the time--Tom Paine and Ethan Allen the most notable. Both were hostile to the Christian faith and did not see that it could be reformed as Jefferson and other Unitarians believed it could.

72 posted on 05/20/2003 1:36:38 PM PDT by DPB101
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To: jimt
I don't believe they established a nation at all: it was a federation of sovereign states. While Virginia may have enjoyed a deistic freedom other states mandated forms of Christianity as the official religion.
115 posted on 05/20/2003 8:06:26 PM PDT by TradicalRC (Fides quaerens intellectum.)
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