LEARNING FROM OSLO

New York Post ^ | 6/10/03 | DANIEL PIPES

[kattracks]

June 10, 2003 -- CAN the "road map" that President Bush just launched do better than the dismal failure of prior Palestinian-Israeli diplomacy? Yes - if it avoids making the same mistakes.

The failure of the last round was foreshadowed at its very start, on Sept. 13, 1993 - the day of the famous handshake between arch-enemies Yitzhak Rabin and Yasser Arafat on the White House lawn and the signing of the Oslo accord.

[MEG33]

Agreed.We must not ask Israel to stop defending itself.

[Truth29]

Bush is already overlooking new Palestinian terrorist attacks and stating that he will not allow such acts to delay the road map. Abbas has said he will not use force against Hamas and the other terrorists.

Not a promising beginning.

[MEG33]

Good article by Daniel Pipes.

[goldstategop]

Best article I have seen Daniel Pipes write. I hope when he meets President Bush he puts it straight across like this. State's nodding and winking at Arab terror won't make the road map a reality.

[Turbodog]

The terrorism will never stop. If Abbas does decide to get serious and really work to stamp out terrorism, they'll kill him. Frankly, I'm surprised he is still alive at this point.

[yonif]

bump.
Zero tolerance for terrorism and no cease-fire with terrorism. They all must be destroyed.

[Tailgunner Joe]

bttt

[The Westerner]

If you are right, then Daniel Pipes is already predicting failure. I guess we all knew that anyway.

[SJackson]

If you'd like to be on or off this middle east/political ping list, please FR mail me.

[Sabertooth]

CAN the "road map" that President Bush just launched do better than the dismal failure of prior Palestinian-Israeli diplomacy? Yes - if it avoids making the same mistakes.

The failure of the last round was foreshadowed at its very start, on Sept. 13, 1993 - the day of the famous handshake between arch-enemies Yitzhak Rabin and Yasser Arafat on the White House lawn and the signing of the Oslo accord.

This is Historically inaccurate. The inevitable failure of both this Road Map and the Oslo accords were foreshadowed, in recent times, by the failure League of Nations Mandate and the partition of Palestine, which established Jordan as the "palestinian" homeland in 1922. In every instance in the last 85 years, where the Jews have swapped land for peace in response to Arab Muslim terror (and it's always in response to Arab Muslim terror), the bloodthirst of the "palestinians" has only been whetted.

President Bush's Road Map once again rewards anti-Semitic butchery, and will lead to the same dead end.

Ironically, should President Bush be serious about his round of diplomacy succeeding, he must give more consequence to the murder of Israelis than did successive Israeli prime ministers. He must be willing to delay the timetable he has set out until the Palestinians truly fulfill his requirements of them.

"Delay the timetable?" I usually like Pipes, but this article is deluded. Islamofascism (a redundant term, I know) is like communism: treaties are entered to gain from the West what could not be gained by force, with the full intention of breaking them once the gains are consolidated. Those who wish our destruction, and that of our allies, know full well that they can rely on the Islamic Stockholm Syndrome which infects Western foreign policy. Our diplomats fantasize that if only we are nicer to Islam and it's intractable hostility, the kumbayas will certainly trill from the minarets.

Arab Muslims, like the communists prior to Ronald Reagan, are never held accountable for their duplicities and atrocities. It?s considered wise foreign policy to give the "palestinians" and their allies endless opportunities to destroy Israel, while delay of that destruction is the only penalty ever paid. Self-induced and Baal-like sacrifices to homicide bombing, and using children and women as human shields aren?t actual penalties, they are the modern manifestation of the cost of doing traditional Islamic business in the marketplace of History.

President Bush is on a fool's errand with his Road Map. The War on Terror started long before September 11th, 2001, and our loyal friend Israel has been fighting a lonely war of attrition on the Eastern Mediterranean front. It's past time American leaders stopped ignoring Israel's sacrifices, and recognized that her war is our war.

President Bush proclaimed that the world is either with us, or with the terrorists. Terror is the foundational lie of the so-called "palestinian" national identity. The "palestinians" are clearly not with us against terror, they are its supreme embodiment. Is the War on Terror over? Have we switched sides? What possible wisdom, honor, valor or virtue is to be found in forcing Israel to once again bare its throat to murderous savages?

Times come when war is inevitable. If averting our eyes from these inevitabilities delays a war, it only leads to more tragedy and bloodshed. The paradox of wars, when they are Just Wars, is that they are merciful. When a people nurses a lust for war in their hearts, then only war can remove it. The "palestinians" have doted over their warlust with a love that exceeds that of their own children. The sad truth is that the true Road Map for peace in Israel is through war. Rewarding "palestinian" terror with a second homeland carved from a butchered Israel will also lead to war, but far worse than if we let Israel give the "palestinians" the war for which they are so clearly begging at a time of Israel's choosing.

In fact, the "palestinians" have never not been at war with Israel, they have only duplicitously pleaded for sporadic cease-fires when they've been soundly defeated. Cease-fires, however, do not lead to peace; we should have learned that after the first Gulf War in 1991, at the very least. Their desire is to destroy Israel and kill the Jews or drive them from the Holy Land.

There is one answer to wars of aggression, such as the "palestinians" are currently waging against Israel: the aggressors must lose territory. There is no better deterrent. Therefore, the time has come for these "palestinians" to lose their territory, not usurp more of Israel. They are clearly incapable of peaceful and civilized behavior, even amongst themselves, let alone with Israelis. Future generations of barbarians are already in the pipeline, having been indoctrinated with the same murderous, genocidal anti-Semitism that held Nazi Germany in thrall. There is no possibility of harmonic peace on common ground with the likes of the mortal evil faced by Israel in the "palestinians."

War must come. The "palestinians" that survive must be removed from Israel in all parts of the former Transjordan and repatriated to the first and only "palestinian" homeland, Jordan, East of the River. If this unravels the turbans of Jordan?s occupying Arabian Hashemites, led by King Abdullah, then perhaps it's time he took up their grievances with his Historical usurpers, the Wahabbist House of Saud. However, that is a matter for Muslims to work out amongst themselves in their usual murderous fashion.

It's time to burn the Road Map, and let Israel be Israel.

[MeekOneGOP]

Howdy ! I see you have a new kitty.

More bump images HERE !

[SkyPilot]

Saber,

How are ya? Where have you been?

[Optimist]

"The Process" is NOT the most important thing!

Powell keeps saying that Israel can't let the suicide attacks disrupt the process so there should be no retaliation. Furthermore, that we must maintain the timetable.

Excuse me, but if "the process" does not eliminate terrorism, it is a farce of a peace plan; if "the process" guarantees a Palestinian State without security, it is a farce; if the process does not result in peace by eliminating the threats to that peace ..... "THE PROCESS" is a FARCE!!

[Ernest_at_the_Beach]

Thanks for the ping, been missing you!

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[sarasmom]

BTTT

[Torie]

Hi Saber, good to "see" you again.

At least in traducing Bush's efforts to push along the road map, you offer a concrete alternative, rather than just whine, as far too many around here do. But your alternative is a chimera; it will not happen, not ever. It will not happen because it is wrong, morally, and impractically, and would have horrific consequences to US interests if the US underwrote it, as it would have to do. The US will not do that; indeed, if Israel set about to do it on its own, I suspect the US would threaten, first privately, and then publically, to send its own troops in as part of a multinational force to stop it, and of course the very threat would stop it. Israel is not going to fire on US troops.

Why is it wrong, morally and practically?

War must come. The "palestinians" that survive must be removed from Israel in all parts of the former Transjordan and repatriated to the first and only "palestinian" homeland, Jordan, East of the River.

It is wrong because the above is only moral if there is no other alternative to Israel's survival (or horrific unending large scale slaughters of Israeli civilians, which only your alternative can secure). (As a sidebar, you seem to also suggest expelling Arabs living in Israel proper that are Israeli citizens, and with only one or two exceptions have not been terrorist perps, but that is a detail.)

And of course there is an alternative. The alternative is to build that wall, and also have Israeli troops on the Jordan River in unpopulated areas. All Palestinian airports if there are any would be shut down. Israel would control everything that goes in or out of the West Bank. The place would be turned into a Bantustan, and would stay that way until the place expelled and/or killed all the perps, and Hamas and the like were destroyed. More subtlely, the place would be subject to slow economic strangulation, and that would precipitate emigration. No one from the Bantustan would be allowed into Israel under any circumstances, for any reason.

The US would make clear privately to Arab capitals that it would underwrite the Bantustan, unless they got active in lending their support in every way to wiping out Hamas and the perps. It would be up to them to get the roadmap back on track, or watch the slide to Bantustan status, until matters got back on track, with real deeds and accomplishments on the ground. For the US to underwrite the Bantustan, however, Israel would have to stay out of populated areas and abandon remote settlements. The lines of the Bantustan would be, if a state ever emerged, the lines of the state, plus appending thereto the empty zone to the Jordan River, after ALL of the requisite conditions were met.

There is no other way out of the box. The two alternatives I have outlined are the ONLY two alternatives. Yours is too Draconian, too vengeful, too contrary to US interests, and well, just plain wrong. You simply don't drive out a people if there are less Draconian alternatives. That cannot be tolerated, anywhere, at any time.

I agree with your implication, and if not your implication, my assertion, that the status quo will over time cause the slow degradation of Israel. Jersulalem is slowly dying. Emigration of Jews from Israel is increasing. The percentage of non Jews in Israel is increasing at a material rate (perhaps that is inevitable, but the status quo accelerates it, and those leaving tend to be the best and brightest of the young).

Give the roadmap a chance. Give Bush a chance. When it is clear that the roadmap is comatose, and terminally comatose, with no real prospects that the cadaver can be reanimated absent electric shock therapy, noises about the Bantustan can begin to be made, from the US. Meanwhile, the wall must be constructed, not with all deliberate speed, but with proactive and energetic speed.

That is my opinion of the lay of the land. Best regards.

[Torie]

My latest ruminations for your consideration.

[Torie]

Time to branch out Hop. There is other work to do out there. Any comments?

[swany]

Ever think of running for President?