Catholic bishop of Phoenix arrested

FOXNEWS | 6/16/2003 | John Gibson

[sinkspur]

Roman Catholic bishop John O'Brien was arrested for leaving the scene of a fatal hit-and-run accident, and his car impounded.

[ELS]

The title Your/His Eminence is for Cardinals. O'Brien is not a Cardinal.

[TotusTuus]

It will serve no purpose other than to remind lurkers that O'Brien signed a consent agreement to relinquish control over sexual abuse cases to a layman in lieu of being indicted for obstruction of justice

No, he did not. That is not what the agreement states. It has been posted elsewhere, if not on this thread.

[sinkspur]

No, he did not.

Well, the DA was ready to indict him for obstruction of justice, and O'Brien admitted to moving priests, even though he knew they were guilty of pederasty, and did not inform pastors or parishioners of the receiving parishes.

And, when O'Brien came out and said "there was no cover-up," DA Romley, when questioned about it, said "Does the bishop not remember what he signed?"

Totus, you can spin the agreement however you want to spin it, but the only reason O'Brien wasn't behind bars for that offense was the DA worked out a deal with him.

[saradippity]

Well,it seems to me that shows Catholics were either overrepresented among the troops or they were less able to defend themselves and thus died.

This country has always had between 17% and 23% Catholics,the fact that 33% lost their lives in Nam supports either that Catholics go into the military in higher numbers than non-Catholics or are more apt to die.

I don't know about the 60% number either.

[kstewskis]

Look, does anyone here honestly think O'Brien would have left another human being to suffer or die if he had understood what had happened?

Knowing this man's tendency to hide from unfavorable media (and not very good at that, I might add)....sadly, yes.

[saradippity]

Sinkspur,you are wrong again.The county Attorney said,in defending his position in not indicting him to begin with,that he could have indicted him but he might very well have been found not guilty. But the bigger problem was that had he been found guilty,he probably would have gotten a year or two which most likely would have been suspended anyway.

He felt that his cooperation and acknowledgement would not hinder other charges if new information came out and would save time in the long run.

Regards the wildlife in Phoenix,I lived in what could have been called the inner city (4 miles south of the action) and this week coyotes were spotted walking around within a block of my house.

BTW,I have no idea of what happened last Saturday night but I suspect the bishop has been scared out of his wits for a while now,unfortunately because he has lied so frequently,he has no credibility. Let this be a lesson for all,"TELL THE TRUTH".

[Robert_Paulson2]

Could have been any of us - and almost happened to me along that same strecth of road, on several different occasions no less.

---

I agree with most of your post but this part.

exceppt.... YOU would have stopped after the accident. YOU would not have tried to get the windshield replaced on Sunday to hide your crime. YOU would have offered last rites. The problem is, this bishop, did not.

I hardly think his actions representative of my Catholic family members... and suggest humbly that YOUR reactions to such an accident would very likely be like theirs... stop, call for police, offer assistance, and pray for the wounded... till the medics, police and fire department officials arrived.

May your tribe increase... and may this bishop's... be put out to pasture.
fwiw...

to be honest with you, I don't know even ONE catholic family member or friend who would behave in any other way, than to do what is right in such manners. The ones I know won't even tell a little white lie... let alone leave the scene of an accident.

[sinkspur]

The county Attorney said,in defending his position in not indicting him to begin with,that he could have indicted him but he might very well have been found not guilty.

Which, as you know sara, could be said of any defendent, in any case, anywhere, at any time.

No. Romley didn't indict him because he didn't want to be the first to indict a Catholic bishop in a sex abuse case, so he gave him a way out, which was to relinquish authority over sex abuse cases to someone else, and he had O'Brien sign an agreement that said, basically, that O'Brien was guilty.

[plusone]

You bring up good points. True, much of what we view, and think to be real, is just subjective interpretation. But where does that leave us? If we can't really be certain of anything, then do we reject everything as possibly false, or accept it all, because it might be true? Without granting some common sense leeway, we are stuck with no guidposts, we are just lost. But how does this apply to the possibly devine nature of scripture? If you must accept that the Bible is devinely inspired, since there is no way to prove the notion false, then must you accept all religious texts?

[Robert_Paulson2]

You hit it on the head again... EXACTLY....
The DA had given him a way out.
It appears that sovereignty, or irony, may have just taken that option away for good.

The agrement was posted here. O'Brien said as much as "I am guilty" in his agreement. The spinning of the agreement however was becoming way to clintonesque...

The manslaughter charge will not be so ambiguous.

[kstewskis]

No excuse for Swaggart though. If you cannot keep it zipped, or resist going after "strange" women, you don't really belong in Christian ministry...

Agreed.

One thing I have to respect Swaggart with, is that he faced the music, and publicly asked for forgiveness for his sin(s). Something many of us Catholics wished our church leaders would do, when they've done wrong.

[Robert_Paulson2]

Not to be too hard on the Catholic leadership... I think some have.
Don't ask for a list... but some have done the right thing.

[FITZ]

how vital it is to place our faith and trust in Him, not in church leaders who are bound to disappoint us

Church leaders are not immune from human weaknesses and sin, they also need salvation, they also can go to Hell --- it's not really any different in a corporation, just because someone is higher up in status doesn't make them less likely to commit fraud, embezzle or cheat. We can't believe leaders and other higher-ups are some special class ----they all need their feet held to the fire, they all must be watched closely and kept honest.

[Robert_Paulson2]

He was probably on the horn to pedophiles in other countries, that he had "relocated" with help from a few cardinals... trying to get out of the country quick.

I would LOVE to see his phone logs.
Bet the DA is already seeking them...
Bet the Bishop, will try and NOT surrender them because his calls are "church business" only... and not subject to the courts...

Bet the DA gets the long distance calls accounting anyway...

[FITZ]

Look, does anyone here honestly think O'Brien would have left another human being to suffer or die if he had understood what had happened?

I don't know what he understood, he might have been drunk and not thinking or understanding much. The way I see it ---it's not so different than when you work for a corporation and some VP is caught doing something undefendable. It's not loyalty to the corporation to defend or even try to understand those who might be higher up but behaved like criminals or oafs. You don't quit your job because they do ---you're glad that they were caught and hope things get cleaned up so the company can survive.

[kstewskis]

Not to be too hard on the Catholic leadership... I think some have. Don't ask for a list... but some have done the right thing

Thankfully, yes. And they are the majority. Our parish priest is one of thoese who did the right thing for us last summer, and was punished for it.

Last summer, our parish wrote a letter to O'Brien to address the scandal, and our concerns about it.some ....our parish priest was thrown out of his office and threatened never to bring the subject up again.

Of course, it brought a "collective sigh" to us. But then again, it taught us a thing or two. Let God handle it. Things will work out the way they are meant to be.

[Thorondir]

I guess we fight better.

[Havisham]

The stampede to convict O'Brien (or any catholic priest, for that matter) makes me uneasy.

[St.Chuck]

He was probably on the horn to pedophiles in other countries, that he had "relocated" with help from a few cardinals... trying to get out of the country quick.

Uh....oh never mind.

[IrishRainy]

Had Rome relieved him, he'd have never been there, drunk, to kill that man.

Can't you read? He had absolutely no time at all to get drunk. Witnesses at the Mass he presided at have come forward and said he was perfectly fine at 8:00. Are you saying he drank enough to become drunk in half an hour in the car, or are you just making vile accusations because you obviously HATE the Church?