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Those who are hoping for the worst in Iraq
San Diego Union Tribune ^ | 7/4/2003 | Joseph Perkins

Posted on 07/04/2003 10:23:05 AM PDT by dalereed

Edited on 07/04/2003 12:02:29 PM PDT by Admin Moderator. [history]

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To: ArneFufkin
Been following this blog for a while. Interesting during the war.
61 posted on 07/05/2003 12:42:02 AM PDT by john the bowler
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To: john the bowler
Thanks!
62 posted on 07/05/2003 12:58:54 AM PDT by MEG33
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To: MEG33
When Patton was in North Africa, that seemed impossibly distant from Berlin. Anzio was the end of the World, as was Iwo Jima when Americans were being slaughtered with no progress. But, Iwo Jima became an air base from which we launched on Okinawa. We lost 6800 men on that 8 square mile island. It took a MONTH to take that 8 miles from the enemy.

Can you imagine fighting a War entailing the sacrifice, upheval and complex scope of WWII TODAY, with 24X7 Cable coverage and worldwide communication capability.

There were surreal and ridiculously immense loss of human life in obscenely short moments in that war. Thousands dying in an hour. We dropped fire bombs on civilian populations, killing tens of thousands in Dresden and Berlin in a day.

That was a different era, but the human tragedy is timeless.

It's why you and I sleep in peace and confidence in the security and prosperity of tomorrow each night. That's what the boys are fighting for. That's what they've always fought for. And always will. This is a vital mission, and our soldiers are excelling.

It is right to have worry for your loved ones and insecurity for the future. But ... this is a HISTORIC time in World History. I think the Middle East is going to experience a Renaissance going forward. I do.

63 posted on 07/05/2003 1:03:49 AM PDT by ArneFufkin
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To: Bloody Sam Roberts
How many know we won the Tet offensive?Despite what many radicals of the 60s think,people who were against continuing the war late in the war hated the protestors and the violence.The participants in the protests were not as big a factor as they think.Nobody I knew disparaged our soldiers.Thank God I don't know such people.
64 posted on 07/05/2003 1:09:37 AM PDT by MEG33
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To: john the bowler
It's an interesting perspective and insightful into the mojo in Baghdad.

But, remember ... the Tikritis and most Sunnis of Baghdad were the beneficiaries of the Saddam regime. They were the government functionaries and bureaucrats who got paid. They HAVE lost security and protection and a sense of order in their lives. That's why many are surly and resentful. That's the way it goes, but they're not the ones taking up arms. That's the hardcore Murder Incorporated who have NO future but kill before being killed.

I think the Shiites of Basra and Nasariyah and the Kurds in Mosul might have a different reality. They're not going to get gassed by Chemical Ali or slaughtered by Uday's mobsters because they looked at a woman he fancied.

65 posted on 07/05/2003 1:15:25 AM PDT by ArneFufkin
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To: ArneFufkin
Can you imagine fighting a War entailing the sacrifice, upheval and complex scope of WWII TODAY, with 24X7 Cable coverage and worldwide communication capability.

Nope. And that is why the media was tightly controlled during WWII. The first dead bodies of American soldiers were not even shown to the American public until late 1943 when King Roosevelt thought we were getting lax about the war and "allowed" "Life Magazine" to show three dead bodies of marines on some pacific island beach.

66 posted on 07/05/2003 1:18:51 AM PDT by Burkeman1
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To: MEG33
Thank God I don't know such people.

I knew one, once. He's buried under my pool in the backyard.

Just kidding...but you catch my sentiment.   

67 posted on 07/05/2003 1:24:00 AM PDT by Bloody Sam Roberts (®)
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To: MEG33
The VietNam war was lost when Kennedy had Diem assassinated. That totally undercut our claims of being better than the Soviets or Chinese Communists and it made the South Vietnamese elite highly paranoid of our intentions and prone to fight each other rather than the enemy.
68 posted on 07/05/2003 1:28:16 AM PDT by Burkeman1
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To: Burkeman1
On Anzio beach, the Americans suffered 950 casualties in five hours.

The Allied Command would send hundreds of bomber crewmen to their deaths as a feint to mask another campaign. What a human tragedy. Counting the civilians, there may have been 70 million deaths because Hitler always dreamed of conquering Russia. The Japanese were building their little War Machine to mass murder Chinese and they needed oil that we didn't think they should have given their bad behavior.

What an absurd history Russia has. They must procreate like rabbits there. How do you lose 50-70 million people, 40-50 million men in 35 years? Volume. Volume. Volume.

What a place to grow up in the 30s. You had a good chance of being dead by 1950.

69 posted on 07/05/2003 1:33:35 AM PDT by ArneFufkin
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To: ArneFufkin
Arne,I know more about WW2 than any war we've had.It was truly horrific and our very lives depended on the winning.The bombing of Dresden is controversial today because it had no "strategic"military target.It sure as shooting demoralized the citizens.Great Britain was getting buzz bombed and I haven't a pang about Dresden.I hate innocent civilian deaths.War is hell and I always want our side to have the advantage.I believe with the knowledge we had at the time,the Abomb decision was correct.I always think we must be ready to fight and win.
70 posted on 07/05/2003 1:41:42 AM PDT by MEG33
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To: dalereed
Some of the pap about Iraq is coming from girly-men that get resentful about U.S. military success whenever and however it gets demonstrated. We need a man who'll say "I can make Iraq howl."
71 posted on 07/05/2003 1:43:15 AM PDT by 185JHP ( Down South, where the hogs have jowls...)
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To: ArneFufkin
I have no fear for my children's future as long as we stay vigilant and stay the course.I just think there will always be tyrants and fanatics who wish us ill.WW2 was truly horrific.With today's weapons it could not have been the same war.Mass killing goes on in Africa and the Iran/Iraq war had obscene casualties.We are not a people who send our youth to war without sorrow.That is good.The enemy must understand we will suffer the loss and the sorrow in a just cause.
72 posted on 07/05/2003 1:46:07 AM PDT by MEG33
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To: Bloody Sam Roberts
I missed your post!LOL!
73 posted on 07/05/2003 1:59:58 AM PDT by MEG33
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To: MEG33
Bombing civilians is what it took to close that War. When the civilians are actively manufacturing and supplying the soldiers, there are no innocent targets.

The Germans military killed 7.7 million Soviet civilians, 5.3 million Polish civilians, 1.3 million Yugoslavian citizens and almost 400,000 French, 330,000 Czechs. The Japanese killed 10 million Chinese civilians.

Because we dropped the two big boys on Japan, their civilian losses were only 360,000. That was a Godsend for those people.

13 million Chinese died at the hands of the Japanese when the military deaths are added. It's unfathomable.

74 posted on 07/05/2003 2:00:19 AM PDT by ArneFufkin
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To: ArneFufkin
Everyone knows about the Nazis.How many know about the Rape of Nanking?How many know about the 5 year plan and starvation of millions by Stalin?(The communists are arming the Islamofascists.Interesting partners.)
75 posted on 07/05/2003 2:15:32 AM PDT by MEG33
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To: MEG33
Churchill knew FDR was ill and Stalin was going to steamroll him at Yalta for territory in Europe.

I'm convinced the Dresden raid was a statement to Stalin, who Churchill despised and held in total contempt. Come westward, you violent peasant, you'll get all of this. Churchill had no faith in FDR at the point, and he was right in his suspicion.

After the Luftwaffe killed women and children in Coventry and London, after the reports of the genocides in Warsaw and the Ukraine, I don't think Churchill was too concerned about a bombing at the German solar plexis. The firestorm fashioned a horrific vision, we fear burns in a primal way, but Churchill saw toddlers being removed from Coventry rubble and they were just as dead from blunt force trauma as a Saxony artiste who immolated. People buried in rubble die of asphixiation, and most of the victims at Dresden died of asphixiation.

There were reports of 36,000 to 130,000 dead there. 5.6 million Jews were murdered in systematic assembly line death by the German people. War is hell.

Stalin got the message, and while he was rolling FDR he taunted the brilliant old sod with glares. Yalta was a disgrace. Truman, Ike or some Senior Senator should have stepped in to protect American interests. Churchill saw a guy worse than Hitler walk away with the blue ribbon.

76 posted on 07/05/2003 3:04:07 AM PDT by ArneFufkin
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To: ArneFufkin
Alger Hiss was there to lend aid to Roosevelt at Yalta!About the "firebombing".I thought they bombed,fires erupted and created a firestorm.Firestorms are awesome.Thank God for Churchill.He had more power than Eleanor who had communist leaders in America over to sleep in the Lincoln bedroom.
77 posted on 07/05/2003 3:18:29 AM PDT by MEG33
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To: MEG33
No, it was a hellish weapon system. There were three waves of bombers, the first dropped incindiary bombs, the second dropped bombs that opened above ground and sprayed some immolating compound that the ground fires inflamed and a third wave sprayed a compound even higher. Or something like that. It was pretty evil.
78 posted on 07/05/2003 3:30:23 AM PDT by ArneFufkin
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To: ArneFufkin
WOW!What a message!
79 posted on 07/05/2003 3:36:39 AM PDT by MEG33
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To: Captain Kirk
These days Rumsfeld is blindly worshipped as a god on Free Republic.

Well, I think the world of Rumsfeld. I'm not blind, and I certainly don't think of him as a god. Rumsfeld has proven himself to me to be an exceptional leader and I respect him for that.

I remember the days when freepers were skeptical of politicians and burearcrats.

Oh, you mean during the clintoon administration? Gee, I wonder why ?? There is a world of difference betweeen the clintoon administration and the Bush administration, imho.


80 posted on 07/05/2003 3:51:35 AM PDT by MeekOneGOP (Bu-bye Dixie Chimps! / Coming Soon !: Freeper site on Comcast. I lost the URL.)
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