Symposium: Treason? (Klehr, Haynes, Estrich and Brennan detailed discussion of Coulter's book)

Frontpage Magazine ^ | 7/25/03 | Jamie Glazov

[DPB101]

A "stacked deck" is right. Horowitz is using what he learned as a member of the New Left. First he softened up the target with his own attack (which was picked up by liberals across the nation to "prove" Coulter is crazy). Now he has a rigged debate. The moderator is against Coulter. A babbling left wing nut is brought in to offset Ann's one defender. Then two academics who are against Coulter are used to make opposition to Ann appear to be the "reasonable" position.

Well done, David! We're convinced now! The people rise as one to denouce the demagoguette Coulter and her running dogs demagogueweenians.

[conservatism_IS_compassion]

When, pray tell, has Hollywood ever, before or since, acted on any other principle but box office draw and profit?

Whenever they have made a R or X movie knowing that a P or PG movie would be more profitable.

[dix]

I have often thought it is indeed curious that the red diaper types like Horowitz are so critical of Ms Coulter’s dead on take on McCarthy. I believe it was also the overwhelming opinion of the American people during that time.
I have read all of Horowitz’s books, and I have also heard him speak in person. No doubt he has his place in the movement, but I also remember him from the 60’s when he was editor of Ramparts. He is classically trained in communist propaganda techniques. Congrats for picking up on it.

[HISSKGB]

Klehr and Haynes are liars. Klehr totally equivacates about Owen Lattimore who was a big player in the Amerasia Affair and who engineered Mao's taking of China. Truman gave North Korea to the Soviets but Haynes thinks Truman was a good guy. Truman also prevented General MacArthur from liberating North Korea.

[DPB101]

Horowitz has and is doing much good for conservatism. On this one subject, he has a blind spot. As you relate, all the critics are of the same social circle. They simply will not fully admit the damage traitors in their circle did to America and that the traitors, not McCarthy, were the problem.

[nopardons]

"Staked deck " indeed !

I used to just hate, loathe, and abominate David Horowitz. Then, when he dicided to spill the beans and turn somewhat to the " light ", I had a LOVE/HATE ( I can NEVER forgive, nor forget what he did to this country !) relatinship . Now ... I am back to mostly hating him.

He's managed to slit his own throat. Conservatives had begun to embrace him, he was quite popular here. Returning, as he is, to his roots, he's going to wake up and find that not only have all of his old " friends " turned on him, the left spurned him, but, surprise, surprise, so has the RIGHT ! He's a man with no place to go. Serves him right.

[DPB101]

LOL...the sad part of it is if Horowitz had made a reasoned, honest critique of Ann's position, conservatives would have respected that. The GOP is a big tent. Debates are going to happen. But Horowitz has yet to honestly present his position. His first critique was filled with distortions. This "symposium" is simply sneaky. It assumes readers are blithering idiots too dense to know he is staging a show trial (the predetermined verdict of which will be repeated, endlessly, by left wing writers across the nation).

[nopardons]

The problem, for David, is that he's STILL opperating with a Commie mind set. Nature/nurture, whatever, he's an old dog, who though he has tried to learn a new trick, is falling back on the old ones. He's OUTED himself. He imagines that those on the RIGHT, are as stupid and leadable, as those on the left; we aren't !

It just might be a good idea, for us to let David know what we think of him and this "Kangaroo Court".

[conservatism_IS_compassion]

Estrich: . . .

The Army-McCarthy hearings were televised and recorded.  You can get them on videotape if you know where to look.  I suggest that the Pro-Joe camp invite their friends and neighbors over some night for a private screening of "Joe in Action."  If one picture is worth a thousand words, an hour of videotape should be worth a entire library of books like "Treason" and "Slander." If your friends and neighbors are not as repulsed by McCarthy's bullying and unfairness as the American public was when they first watched him in the early 1950s -- when, then, we've gone backwards as a Nation and as a People.

In Treason Ann mentioned the tape, but indicated that it had been edited down to only show McCarthy in a bad light; all McCarthy's effective statements were cut out. Is the whole tape available, or is Estrich blowing smoke over a propaganda version of the truth here?

[DPB101]

I don't know but it is so typical of a liberal to want people to see a TV production rather than read the transcripts.

Appearance vs substance...always the same with liberals.

Oh..look! He's overweight! He sweats! Isn't Joseph Welch handsome? Roy Cohen looks like a sneak. How can anyone stand that Joe McCarthy?"

[Arthur Wildfire! March]

"The Army had such a distrust of Truman that they didn't even tell him about the Venona files."

LOL!

That just about says it all about says it all! I wish they invited you there. =]

[Arthur Wildfire! March]

"Horowitz has and is doing much good for conservatism. On this one subject, he has a blind spot."

My suspicion meter has risen one notch. I'm not convinced that Horowitz is a closet lefty, but I'm not exactly 100% trusting anymore. Blame me? FReegards....

[conservatism_IS_compassion]

Estrich: . . .

The Army-McCarthy hearings were televised and recorded.  You can get them on videotape if you know where to look.  I suggest that the Pro-Joe camp invite their friends and neighbors over some night for a private screening of "Joe in Action."  If one picture is worth a thousand words, an hour of videotape should be worth a entire library of books like "Treason" and "Slander." If your friends and neighbors are not as repulsed by McCarthy's bullying and unfairness as the American public was when they first watched him in the early 1950s -- when, then, we've gone backwards as a Nation and as a People.

In Treason Ann mentioned the tape, but indicated that it had been edited down to only show McCarthy in a bad light; all McCarthy's effective statements were cut out. Is the whole tape available, or is Estrich blowing smoke over a propaganda version of the truth here?

Fran, you might know?

[DPB101]

Bet the tape is heavily edited. Ever see a conservative who wasn't? There is also the matter of the viewer not having a clue who is testifying, what they said in other hearings and what they are hiding.

[conservatism_IS_compassion]

Liberals, in their almost pathological defense of the underdog, ANY underdog, have jumped to the cause of practically anybody who has a grievance with the way government is administered.

I am interested in the nexus between liberalism and entertainment, and I consider the "underdog" mentality a big part of that.

It is often claimed that the press is the critical guarantee of our freedom, and that is true in principle. But "the press" in the First Amendment includes books, for example, and is not limited to the mass entertainment known as journalism. Journalism, to have something to get our attention with, has a hypercritical attitude towards the institutions upon which we depend--in HOPES of ginning up an excuse to ask, "Is Your Drinking Water Safe?"

Journalism IMHO is not harmless; it is perhaps an acid test of our institutions--necessary but NOT without corrosive effect.

[AFPhys]

[Brennan:]... Read her book Susan, you might learn something.

Estrich: In one of the reviews of Ann's book, it quotes her description of Joe McCarthy as someone ...

Let me get this right... is Estrich here actually admitting that she is caught having a critical discussion about Ann's book when she did not even read the book, much less think about what it says and look at the supporting footnotes? I believe this is what happens here, and that ought to be devastating to her credibility.

[conservatism_IS_compassion]

Bet the tape is heavily edited. Ever see a conservative who wasn't? There is also the matter of the viewer not having a clue who is testifying, what they said in other hearings and what they are hiding.

I see no reason to suppose that the original unedited tape even survives, let alone is available to the public.

And it the difference between the unedited Rodney King video, placed in context by competing lawyers in front of a suburban jury, and the edited version incessantly rebroadcast to "the community," bears remembering. The difference, that is, between the initial acquittal of Stacy Koon--and the riot immediately following it!

At a minimum we need a posting of the transcript of the actual hearing, annotated with the cuts made for effect by the traitors.

Better would be an audio if not a video dramatization of the missing parts; it would only be fair if an attractive actor made a sympathetic portrayal of the McCarthy role, given that the traitors committed the original offense against the record by cutting out the actual video.

[Tailgunner Joe]

bump

[Calpernia]

Hence the love of hollywood.

I was on one of those morgue shot threads of the hussein sons. Someone actually posted that he has seen more realistic shots of dead people in the movies. Ahh, yeah. Nothing you can say in reponse to that. Sometimes you have the shake your head and walk away.

[VOA]

...the conservative pundit and author arguably went too far by
1)defending Joseph MacCarthy
and
2) accusing all liberals of treason...

at risk of being a "broken record", but for benefit of lurkers, I repeat the following:

...1)defending Joseph MacCarthy...

Even PBS has defended McCarthy to some degree.
Their PBS special "Secret, Lies and Atomic Spies" admits that McCarthy was right...the
USA guvmint was riddled with USSR agents/collaborators/sympathizers
AND
McCarthy was wrong on specifics BECAUSE the FBI and other agencies knowingly
witheld specific information that they (FBI, etc.) feared would compromise
convictions in the future.

2) accusing all liberals of treason...
Lawd Almighty, they do seem to travel in a pack.
There are more people of this ilk calling talk radio in Los Agneles and whining, wailing and
beating their breasts over the "murder"/"illegal assassination" of Uday and Quasy...than
there are in Baghdad (as revealed by positive comments from Iraqi citizens concerning their deaths
and the release of post-mortem photos in The Los Angeles Times; Friday, 7-25-03).