Onward Christian soldiers (Janissaries. Christian boys were forced to fight for Islam)

world net daily ^ | SATURDAYMAY 262001 | Anthony C. LoBaido

[Mark17]

I know we have not done this for awhile, but, religion of peace alert.

[muawiyah]

"Yes, it is the Muslims – not the white Europeans who were the first and greatest slave traders" Sho'nuff some surprise to the Romans that they were not white Europeans!

And hey, folks, the Spartans were also Europeans. Their society consisted of mostly slaves with a few guards ~ those guards are the Spartans we look back on in awe.

Then there were the Egyptians, the Babylonians, and on and on and on. Slavery is a common human problem.

Any article that attempts to absolve one group and blame another for slavery is, by definition, propaganda and not to be trusted in any respect.

[muawiyah]

I have to also reject the writer's underlying thesis that "history" is somehow inherited.

[Thorondir]

Ahhh... the sweet religion of peaceTERROR!
It's time to stop the ROT.

Human civilization had better wake up soon and get as serious about its survival as the seventh-century savages are about our annihilation!

[joesnuffy]

I have to also reject the writer's underlying thesis that "history" is somehow inherited.

Yep..according to K Marx history is written (re-written) by those in power (the winners)

[muawiyah]

I didn't know Marx was an expert in genetics (although the commies probably made some claims in that regard).

I was referring to the type of "inheritence" you get with your parent's DNA, not the passing of knowledge through normal means (language, experience).

I have noticed that the history of the Celtic people in ancient Gaul was written by the Romans, and that of the Celtic people in ancient Spain was written by the Greeks before them.

Does that mean the Greeks and Romans were Marxists?

[Destro]

From my post: U.S. soldiers pray for safety on Baghdad streets

Compare the Christian soldier's prayer to that of a Muslim soldier's prayer to God.

A BYZANTINE PRAYER FOR SOLDIERS

"O Holy Master, Almighty Father and Pre-Eternal God, Who alone made and directs all things; Who rise up quickly against the evil of the impious ones; Who, by Providence, teach Thy people preservation of Justice and the obliteration of the sword on earth; Who condescend to raise up military columns to help the people: O God, Who commanded the Forerunner John to say to the soldiers coming to him in the desert, 'Do not intimidate anyone... and be content with your wages':

We entreat Thee with compunction, that Thou gavest Thy child David the power to defeat Goliath, and as Thou didst condescend, through Judas Maccabeus, to seize victory from the arrogant pagans who would not call on Thy Name; so too, grant protection in righteousness and truth to these Thy servants against the enemies rising against them, and by Thy heavenly loving-kindness, strength and might for the preservation of faith and truth.

Condescend, out of Thy mercy, O Master, to grant them the fear of Thee, together with humility, obedience and good endurance; that they kill no one unrighteously, but rather preserve all righteousness and truth; that they may fear Thee and honor Justice; that they run in friendship to those who are scattered, extending thy love to those near them, serving the elderly with justice; and that their ranks fulfill all things righteously;

For thou art our God, and to Thee do we ascribe glory; to the Father, and to the Son, and to the Holy Spirit, now and ever, and unto ages of ages. Amen."

The Turks' Prayer against the Christians

Eternal God and creator of all things, and thou O Mahomet his sacred and divine prophet. We beseech thee let us not dread the Christians, who are so mean and silly to rely on a crucified god. By the power of thy right hand, so strengthen ours that we may surround this foolish people, on every side, and utterly destroy them. At length fulfill our prayers and put these miscreants into our hands, that we may establish thy throne for ever in Mecca, and sacrifice all those enemies of our most holy religion at thy tomb. Blow us with thy mighty breath like swarms of flies into their quarters, and let the eyes of these infidels bedazelled with the lustre of our moon. Consume them with thy fiery darts, and blind them with the dust which they themselves have raised. Destroy them all in thine anger. Break all their bones in pieces, and consume the flesh and blood of those who defile thy sacrifice, and hang the sacred light of circumcision on their cross. Wash them with showers of many waters, who are so stupid to worship gods they know not: and make their Christ a son to that God who ne're begot him. Hasten therefore their destruction we humbly entreat thee, and blot out their name and religion, which they glory so much in, from off the face of the earth, that they may be no more, who condemn and mock at thy law. Amen.

[Destro]

The Spartans had no slaves--they had their Helots held in a Serf like arrangement. You could not buy and sell Helots who were tied to their land for life. The Helots had to give up 50% of their crops to the Spartan state. The Sparatans did indeed develop their military ways to keep the Helots from revolting so your "guards" refrence is accurate. Spartans did not practice chattel slavery or own chattel slaves.

[Savage Beast]

Well obviously all their praying was to no avail, and no wonder--they were praying to Satan, asking him to do their will (which he couldn't), not to God, asking that they do His will. What a bunch of fools.

[Destro]

I posted the prayers not to show that one religion or the other has the ear of God. I posted them because prayers and what is asked for in prayers tells you something about the society that spawned such prayers.

In truth--which civilization's soldiers prayer would be closest to what we secular Americans/Europeans consider civilized and humane expressions of military might? The Christian one or the Muslim one?

[TomSmedley]

SPeaking as a soldier in the current cultural war -- I view the "TAG" (talented and gifted) programs of the public school system as a technique for raising up janissaries for the needs of the self-deifying State.

[muawiyah]

From the Helot's point of view that's just so much BS. The Spartans kept the Helots as slaves. The Celt's kept the Germans as slaves, albeit in tribal groups, but in slavery nonetheless.

The Iriquois understood the concept quite well having been the slaves of the Algonquins earlier. Their histories, when reduced to writing, all begin, "when we were slaves". So, too with the Jews!

Slavery is such a universal situation with humanity that anyone who denies that it existed at one time or the other among any group of humans is simply not to be trusted.

BTW, one of the little stories in the ancient Briton stories of Arthur has him showing Christian piety and kindness by hunting down another man's slave and returning the slave to the master.

Like I said, universal!

[Mike Darancette]

To be realistic I'll bet that A Christian Boy impressed into the Janissaries had a better chance of a good life than a farmer impressed into the army of Edward I.

[Destro]

As someone who studied the matter I can tell you first hand the Helots DID NOT view themselves as slaves nor did the Spartans view them as such. The Helots were well aware of slavery in Greece. The slave markets were everywhere in Greece. The Helots knew they were oppressed but they never viewed themselves as slaves. All forms of opression are not slavery.

[Destro]

That is not at all so! Most Janissaries did not live long or well. Janissaries lived a brutal barracks life. It was Turkish practice to make a Janissaries life during peacetime a living hell. This harsh discipline treatment was eased up during campaigns. The theory being that the Janissaries would look forward to war and be miserable in peace and thus be willing and enthusiastic about going to war for the Sultan.

[muawiyah]

You're just being a Spartan enabler. If we take those Helots out away from their guards (along with their families) to someplace like Athens, they are goin go tell quite a different story and you know it.

[Destro]

THE CORPS OF THE JANIZARIES

But life in the barracks was hard and the discipline compared in severity with that of a cloister. Blind obedience to their superiors was inculcated in them, as well as a fanatical subservience to the Sultan, to whom they belonged in body and soul. They slept in lighted rooms under the watchful eyes of eunuchs who punished severely every noise or other impropriety on their part. All individuality and freedom was suppressed in the acemi oglan, and as a reaction to this, they sought relaxation in excesses against Christian and Jews. Particularly did they display a fanatical hatred of Christians, proof that Islamization had been thorough.

[Destro]

I have studied the Greek originals. It is my forte. I dare you to find one account written by the Greeks themselves from any city state in which the Helot is identified as a "slave".

[Thorondir]

Your lying to try to make everyone else look almost as evil as the Musli is not fooling anyone.