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Affronts and Provocations
National Review Online ^ | Aug.25 2003 | John Derbyshire

Posted on 08/25/2003 5:22:52 PM PDT by NortNork

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1 posted on 08/25/2003 5:22:52 PM PDT by NortNork
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To: NortNork
Great Read! Seperation of church and state is an abridgement of Gods rights.
2 posted on 08/25/2003 5:28:54 PM PDT by exnavy
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To: NortNork
Interesting take.
3 posted on 08/25/2003 5:31:54 PM PDT by tet68
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To: NortNork
A vigorous, two-handed bump to the top for another masterpiece by Derbyshire. Why is it that these English imports -- Derbyshire and Steyn -- use the King's English so much better than us Americans? Maybe because they were brought up and educated more in the classics -- surrounded by the words of those who used the King's English well.

We have our own set of such writers. Jefferson, Adams, Franklin, Madison, Henry. But we are not exposed to them in our educations because they are, after all, "dead white males." Alas.

Congressman Billybob

Latest column, "In the Justices We Trust?" posted on FR and ChronWatch, other publication to come.

4 posted on 08/25/2003 5:38:45 PM PDT by Congressman Billybob ("Don't just stand there. Run for Congress." www.ArmorforCongress.com)
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To: NortNork
BTTT
5 posted on 08/25/2003 5:40:10 PM PDT by Texas_Jarhead
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To: NortNork
"Is a religious Test being required as a Qualification to some Office or public Trust under the United States June 16, 2003

No Catholic Judges Need Apply

BOSTON, MA - Your Catholic Voice President Ray Flynn has sent urgent “wake-up” emails to 150,000 YCV members urging them to support the confirmation of Alabama Attorney General Bill Pryor to the US Court of Appeals.

“To deny Bill Pryor a seat on the Appeals Court because he is a faithful Catholic is anti-Catholic bigotry pure and simple,” Flynn said. “Attorney General Pryor has all of the qualifications for confirmation. He is a man of integrity with outstanding legal background, and the judicial temperament to serve the nation.

“I pray we haven’t reached the day in the United States when faithful Catholic lawyers cannot serve on the bench because they are faithful prolife Catholics?

6 posted on 08/25/2003 5:43:09 PM PDT by Capt. Tom (anything done in moderation shows a lack of interest -Capt. Tom circa 1948)
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To: NortNork; Miss Marple; risk; kattracks; NutCrackerBoy; Chancellor Palpatine; Tauzero; lugsoul
An oustanding essay. Those who are not Liberal moles may want to take this to heart. Those who are, are in our prayers for we are instructed to love our enemies. But, Lord, it's hard.

Love and peace.
7 posted on 08/25/2003 5:51:01 PM PDT by moneyrunner (I have not flattered its rank breath, nor bowed to its idolatries a patient knee.)
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To: NortNork
These articles are interesting because in my old home town of La Crosse, Wisconsin there is currently a flap going on about a ten commandments statue in a public park. Some atheists complained, and the statue was to be moved. The land where the statue is located was purchased by the Lions Club whose building was across the across the street, but that wasn't good enough for a federal judge named Crabb who ordered the monument moved out of the park anyway. Is this not the federal government unconstitionally involving inself in state matters? Nobody is forced to look at the monument. I should add like Derbyshire I'm a Christian but hardly a fundamentalist nor even a church-goer. Neither is my fiancee who agrees with me and she's a Democrat to boot, but so what. The statue hurts no one. Our country was founded by people who were very religious and based our laws and constitution on the ten commandment. What's next? Remove in God we trust from the currency? These atheists have to get a life.
8 posted on 08/25/2003 5:51:31 PM PDT by driftless ( For life-long happiness, learn how to play the accordion.)
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To: moneyrunner
A most excellent piece. Spot on. Thanks for the ping.
9 posted on 08/25/2003 6:16:48 PM PDT by Tauzero (My reserve bank chairman can beat up your reserve bank chairman)
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To: NortNork
I stumbled onto this essay earlier today. I've been a "freeper" for a while now, and this is the first article I actually tried to post (unsuccessfully, I might add).

THANK YOU for posting this....and a great, big BTTT!

The essay is a great read~~~and a must save!
10 posted on 08/25/2003 6:17:36 PM PDT by Right_in_Virginia
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To: driftless
"...this one sailed easily through my pocket-Constitution test."

Well, from what I can tell, it does pass through the Constitution easily enough. On the other hand, if you would consider that this is taking place in Alabama, you might have the wisdom to consult the Constitution of Alabama. But, as you obviously did not, I have saved you the trouble:

Section 3: "That no religion shall be established by law; that no preference shall be given by law to any religious sect, society, denomination, or mode of worship; that no one shall be compelled by law to attend any place of worship; nor to pay any tithes, taxes, or other rate for building or repairing any place of worship, or for maintaining any minister or ministry; that no religious test shall be required as a qualification to any office or public trust under this state; and that the civil rights, privileges, and capacities of any citizen shall not be in any manner affected by his religious principles."

Now, if you would be so kind as to read the text I have put in bold, you will see that it is against the Constitution of Alabama to place the Ten Commandments outside the courthouse, as it shows preference to the Christian religion. The reason it shows preference to the Christian religion, if you could not understand, is because it has taken a symbol/article held sacred by a particular religion and placed it in a building that concerns the judiciary system of that state.

"Our country was founded by people who were very religious and based our laws and constitution on the ten commandment."

As a matter of fact, many of our founding fathers were not "very religious". Thomas Jefferson, for starters, is not thought to be a Christian; far from it, in fact. Benjamin Franklin also struggled with Christian values. Both of these men were the core of those that helped form the foundations for our nation. I will admit that many of our predecessors of this country were Christian, but many of the key people of that era were not.

11 posted on 08/25/2003 6:38:06 PM PDT by CBSmall86
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To: dixiechick2000; WKB; wardaddy; bourbon
Derb hits one out of the park. Here's a sample. You guys gotta read the whole thing, though.

There is a war on: People who hate America are working day and night to destroy us. Just a few months ago they murdered 3,000 of us, and brought down two of our noblest buildings. Manufacturing jobs are long gone, and middle-class paper-shuffling jobs are following them fast. Public-sector unions are pillaging our state treasuries to fund their 50-90 programs (retire at 50 on 90 percent of your salary). Meanwhile, trial lawyers are chewing their way like termites through the private sector. We have 13 million illegal immigrants scoffing at our laws and helping themselves to the welfare provisions that citizens have spent their lifetimes funding through taxes. Two million of us are currently in jail, and the one-eighth of our population that is black supplies one-half of those inmates. Our education systems are collapsing under absurd demands that "no child be left behind" — everyone must be above average! — and hundreds of thousands of citizens have fled those systems in disgust to school their kids at home. Our universities are in the hands of nihilist ideologues who hate their own nation, culture and ancestors. The political system has seized up, impossible-to-cut spending programs crashing head on into impossible-to-raise tax rates. Drop a cigarette butt into some power generator in Cleveland and you can shut down the northeastern U.S.A. for a day. A North Korean nuke has been smuggled across the Mexican border and hidden in a filing cabinet on the 102nd floor of the Sears Tower. (I made that up, but if it hasn't actually happened yet, it won't be long.)

12 posted on 08/25/2003 6:41:52 PM PDT by Yudan (Leave it to a Dimwitcrap to bring a knife to a gunfight.)
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To: CBSmall86
PREAMBLE We, the people of the State of Alabama, in order to establish justice, insure domestic tranquillity, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, invoking the favor and guidance of Almighty God, do ordain and establish the following Constitution and form of government for the State of Alabama:

Same Constitution, sport. Maybe your creative interpretation isn't the orginal intent?

13 posted on 08/25/2003 6:51:04 PM PDT by moneyrunner (I have not flattered its rank breath, nor bowed to its idolatries a patient knee.)
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To: Yudan
Good Stuff BTTT
14 posted on 08/25/2003 6:54:51 PM PDT by WKB (3!~ ( You can hear it anywhere but only here can you tell the world what you think about it))
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To: CBSmall86
Moses received The 10 Comandments 1300 years before the birth of Christ. It shows preference to the Christian Religion?
15 posted on 08/25/2003 7:10:24 PM PDT by NortNork
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To: CBSmall86
that no preference shall be given by law to any religious sect, society, denomination, or mode of worship

Of course, the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court of Alabama would tend to dissagree with you on the meaning and applicability of the state constitutional provision. Your argument also brings up the interesting question of "What is a federal court doing ruling on interpretaion of a State Constitutional provision, most especially concerning the practice of the highest Court in that state?"

as it shows preference to the Christian religion. The reason it shows preference to the Christian religion, if you could not understand, is because it has taken a symbol/article held sacred by a particular religion

Actually several major religions, representing most of the people of the world outside of Asia, and many there as well. Judaism, Christianity, and Islam for starters, and I believe one or two others, all have Moses and the ten commandments as centrally important.

In any event, The tablets are put as examples of Law, not neccessarily religious law. The Supreme Court of the United States has Moses and the tablets depicted on both the inside and outside of their building.

16 posted on 08/25/2003 7:13:48 PM PDT by El Gato
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To: CBSmall86
Did you mean to reply to me? I did not make the remark about passing the constitution test. And I was not referring to Alabama in any event. That's up to the people of Alabama.
17 posted on 08/25/2003 7:16:34 PM PDT by driftless ( For life-long happiness, learn how to play the accordion.)
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To: CBSmall86
Jefferson is commonly considered a "deist", not a Christian. However, "far from it" is hardly accurate--see his rewriting of the Gospels.

I agree with your thrust, but I also disagree with your notion of the Founders' vision of religion and state. Eleven of the first thirteen states had state churches. The Founders thought that states could do what they wished.

Of course, those notions became in extremis after the second American Revolution of 1860-1865.

18 posted on 08/25/2003 9:27:19 PM PDT by jammer
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To: driftless
Is this not the federal government unconstitionally involving inself in state matters?

I refer you to the last paragraph of my post #18. The 10th Amendment is moribund.

19 posted on 08/25/2003 9:29:42 PM PDT by jammer
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To: Congressman Billybob
Why is it that these English imports -- Derbyshire and Steyn -- use the King's English so much better than us Americans?

Honorable Billy Bob, it should be we Americans. In other words, better than we Americans do. Please accept my correction in the spirit it was given -- to be of utmost help and support. I am sure that you will kindly return the favor one day soon :-)

20 posted on 08/25/2003 10:16:34 PM PDT by risk
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