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To: Taiwan Bocks
Questioning authority, especially Homeland Security, is now treasonous or being a terrorist.

Buy a vowel, or get a clue my friend. You can't treat terrorists the same as common criminals with all the rights of discovery, open trial, etc. Thats how 911 happened. If you are not a terrorist, you've got no fear of the patriot act. After your 18th birthday, maybe you'll understand the serious nature of whats going on. In the meantime, don't count on your teachers to help much.

15 posted on 09/14/2003 8:37:55 PM PDT by Go Gordon
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To: Go Gordon
Wow, you sure showed me.

Guess open borders until only dictatorial Homeland Security II is enacted is the best way.

Gosh, you have all the answers.

Are you saying "Seig Heil Homeland Security!" yet?

You are naive or stupid. There's a cure for one of those, sir.

17 posted on 09/14/2003 8:54:48 PM PDT by Taiwan Bocks
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To: Go Gordon
If you are not a terrorist, you've got no fear of the patriot act.

Unless you are a petty criminal running a meth lab, now charged with "making chemical weapons" or a criminal making a pipe bomb now charged with making "a weapon of mass destruction."

New Terror Laws Used Vs. Common Criminals

By DAVID B. CARUSO, Associated Press Writer
PHILADELPHIA - In the two years since law enforcement agencies gained fresh powers to help them track down and punish terrorists, police and prosecutors have increasingly turned the force of the new laws not on al-Qaida cells but on people charged with common crimes.

The Justice Department said it has used authority given to it by the USA Patriot Act to crack down on currency smugglers and seize money hidden overseas by alleged bookies, con artists and drug dealers.

Federal prosecutors used the act in June to file a charge of "terrorism using a weapon of mass destruction" against a California man after a pipe bomb exploded in his lap, wounding him as he sat in his car.

A North Carolina county prosecutor charged a man accused of running a methamphetamine lab with breaking a new state law barring the manufacture of chemical weapons. If convicted, Martin Dwayne Miller could get 12 years to life in prison for a crime that usually brings about six months.

Prosecutor Jerry Wilson says he isn't abusing the law, which defines chemical weapons of mass destruction as "any substance that is designed or has the capability to cause death or serious injury" and contains toxic chemicals.

Civil liberties and legal defense groups are bothered by the string of cases, and say the government soon will be routinely using harsh anti-terrorism laws against run-of-the-mill lawbreakers.

"Within six months of passing the Patriot Act, the Justice Department was conducting seminars on how to stretch the new wiretapping provisions to extend them beyond terror cases," said Dan Dodson, a spokesman for the National Association of Criminal Defense Attorneys. "They say they want the Patriot Act to fight terrorism, then, within six months, they are teaching their people how to use it on ordinary citizens."

Prosecutors aren't apologizing.

Attorney General John Ashcroft completed a 16-city tour this week defending the Patriot Act as key to preventing a second catastrophic terrorist attack. Federal prosecutors have brought more than 250 criminal charges under the law, with more than 130 convictions or guilty pleas.

The law, passed two months after the Sept. 11 attacks, erased many restrictions that had barred the government from spying on its citizens, granting agents new powers to use wiretaps, conduct electronic and computer eavesdropping and access private financial data.

Stefan Cassella, deputy chief for legal policy for the Justice Department's asset forfeiture and money laundering section, said that while the Patriot Act's primary focus was on terrorism, lawmakers were aware it contained provisions that had been on prosecutors' wish lists for years and would be used in a wide variety of cases.

In one case prosecuted this year, investigators used a provision of the Patriot Act to recover $4.5 million from a group of telemarketers accused of tricking elderly U.S. citizens into thinking they had won the Canadian lottery. Prosecutors said the defendants told victims they would receive their prize as soon as they paid thousands of dollars in income tax on their winnings.

Before the anti-terrorism act, U.S. officials would have had to use international treaties and appeal for help from foreign governments to retrieve the cash, deposited in banks in Jordan and Israel. Now, they simply seized it from assets held by those banks in the United States.

"These are appropriate uses of the statute," Cassella said. "If we can use the statute to get money back for victims, we are going to do it."

"The record is clear," said Ralph Neas, president of the liberal People for the American Way Foundation. "Ashcroft and the Justice Department have gone too far."


20 posted on 09/14/2003 10:04:55 PM PDT by FreedomCalls (It's the "Statue of Liberty," not the "Statue of Security.")
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To: Go Gordon; Taiwan Bocks
I am way past 18. I am former LEO. I did SAR at GZ. No one is more supportive of our efforts than I. I have read both the patriot act and its little brother CAPPS. I find reason to distrust in both documents.
29 posted on 09/15/2003 8:58:09 AM PDT by wtc911
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