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Death and Martyrdom: An Important Aspect of Early Christian Eschatology
Concordia Theological Quarterly ^ | October 2002 | Dr. William C. Weinrich

Posted on 10/09/2003 10:08:01 PM PDT by Fester Chugabrew

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To: marron
In that sense, a soldier could be a martyr, if his purpose in serving was to oppose evil with his life and his body. In such a case, the men who died in the sands at Normandy, for example, were martyrs.

The nineteenth century essayist Orestes Brownson made a similar point:

"Loyalty," Brownson writes, "is the highest, noblest, and most generous of human virtues, and is the human element of that sublime love or charity which the inspired Apostle tells us is the fulfillment of the law." Loyalty is more specifically human or particular than the supernatural virtue of charity. And charity cannot replace loyalty as a political or national passion. So Christianity elevates "civic virtues to the rank of religious virtues [by] making loyalty a matter of conscience." Brownson even asserts that "he who dies on the battlefield fighting for his country ranks with him who dies at the stake for his faith." More precisely, "Civic virtues are themselves religious virtues, or at least virtues without which there are no religious virtues, since no man who does not love his brother does or can love God."(source)

Any search through pre-20th century literature is bound to find similar examples, like this Hopkins poem, not to mention the tradition of chivalry. Why then the change, I wonder? Perhaps because General Patton's stand has prevailed: the rhetoric of war is no longer about dying for one's country(if it ever was), but in making the other sunavabitch die for his.

21 posted on 10/10/2003 10:43:28 AM PDT by Dumb_Ox
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To: Fester Chugabrew
Thanks for the ping.

Looking forward to reading this when I get a minute.
22 posted on 10/10/2003 2:30:27 PM PDT by bondserv
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To: Fester Chugabrew; KC Burke; Alamo-Girl
As Apollonius faced the penalty of death, one might suppose that the confession he would make would be an explicit confession in the hope of the resurrection from the dead. One might assume that a confession of the second article, something like “I believe in Jesus the Christ who was raised from dead,” would be more appropriately relevant to the context of persecution and martyrdom.

However, the confession of Apollonius was that of the first article of the creed; it was a confession that the true God is the creator of all things.

Bump for a truly glorious post, Fester. BBL

23 posted on 10/10/2003 4:48:06 PM PDT by betty boop (God used beautiful mathematics in creating the world. -- Paul Dirac)
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To: dk/coro
"I have a problem with any individual who wears his ideology (or religion) on his sleeve."

Would you consider Jesus Christ to be someone who "wears his religion on his sleeve?"

24 posted on 10/10/2003 5:13:38 PM PDT by Fester Chugabrew
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To: Fester Chugabrew
My hope is that Christians will hold fast to the Faith ...

That is a just hope, IMO. As for qualifications relating to the label of "martyr," well, that is not so important. Others here have hit on some differences between Christian and Muslim faith (as to martyrdom), and I think the differences are hard to express accurately, but not so difficult to understand accurately.

25 posted on 10/10/2003 5:45:42 PM PDT by Cboldt
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To: Fester Chugabrew
I certainly don't see them being put on trail for their beliefs and being asked to deny their god "or else."

Ummmm .... I think the radical Muslims DO put others on trial. Infidels and all that. I would guess that Muslim pretenders qualify for the "infidel" label. It is an impermisible exercise of ability, for humans to kill other humans in the name of religion. The victim of such travesty will get his just reward, whatever it is. As will the perpetrator.

26 posted on 10/10/2003 5:51:09 PM PDT by Cboldt
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To: Cboldt
"Ummmm .... I think the radical Muslims DO put others on trial. Infidels and all that."

Oh yes. But does it happen that Muslims are put on trial and asked to deny their god or else suffer death? If so, does their death qualify as martyrdom in the strict sense?

27 posted on 10/10/2003 6:26:39 PM PDT by Fester Chugabrew
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To: Fester Chugabrew
But does it happen that Muslims are put on trial and asked to deny their god or else suffer death? If so, does their death qualify as martyrdom in the strict sense?

I don't think infidels necessarily get a "fair trial" and a chance to express the "proper faith." In any event, I think the label of "martyr" is not so important to the person who becomes one. God sorts us out just fine, without our help in affixing labels.

28 posted on 10/10/2003 6:32:08 PM PDT by Cboldt
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To: Fester Chugabrew
What a beautiful essay! I just finished a first read and look forward to reading it more closely later on tonight. Thank you!!!
29 posted on 10/10/2003 8:43:55 PM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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To: betty boop
Volley bump for a great post!
30 posted on 10/10/2003 8:48:03 PM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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To: Cboldt
"I don't think infidels necessarily get a 'fair trial' and a chance to express the 'proper faith.'"

I think the word "infidel" has been mutually applied to Muslim and Christian, so I'm not sure which you mean here.

"In any event, I think the label of 'martyr' is not so important to the person who becomes one. God sorts us out just fine, without our help in affixing labels."

Of course our own labels effect neither objective reality nor the end results WRT the judgment of God, but they are a means to sort things out in our own minds. Furthermore, just as God uses "word" to create and sustain life, there is more than a label or two at stake here.

At bottom I seriously doubt many are put to death these days solely because they confess that their life comes from God alone. These days innocents are killed just because they are an "inconvenience."

31 posted on 10/11/2003 3:09:34 PM PDT by Fester Chugabrew
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To: Fester Chugabrew
I agree with your ultimate conclusion, that while some innocents (believer and non-beliver alike) have been and are being killed in the name of religion, other excuses are more prevalent.

As to my application of the word "infidel," I'd have to review my original comment -- I think I meant it as applied by Muslims to non-Muslims, but it could equally be used by anybody who wanted to attach a pejorative label to justify an impermissible exercise of human power.

I support the "sorting out" of temporal reality, and of ultimate destiny, by humans. I tend away from labels in that endeavor, because we tend to become preoccupied with the "proper assignment of labels" (so what). Arguments over what labels mean should be brief. In order to advance a discussion, agreement about the meaning of labels should be easy to reach.

All that as a matter of agreeing. There is more at stake than a label or two.

32 posted on 10/11/2003 3:31:31 PM PDT by Cboldt
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