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I can hardly find anyone who is doing any good for the Church among the extremes of both camps.

God, on the other hand, says, "The hot and the cold I will take in, but the lukewarm I will spit out of my mouth."

The ferocity of divisions within the Catholic Church is something I was quite unprepared for, and remain somewhat at a loss over.

You must not have realized that you were entering a Church suffering through the throes of revolution. Didn't you notice that the Church you joined had just recently instituted an entirely new liturgy, new doctrines, new practices? And even if you hadn't joined during this turbulent time, I hope you were aware that you were becoming part of the "Chruch militant." Remember that "Heaven is only won by force and the violent shall bear it away."

In the throes of revolution? recently instituted? I thought Vatican II was in the 60's, or how many decades past do you still consider "recent"? No, I was obviously not aware the gates of Hell were prevailing against the Church.

You also seem to have misunderstood my post by your effort to contradict me with Scripture. I never said which extreme was right or wrong, all I said was that neither one is doing their professed goal any good.

From what I know of the pre-Vatican II ways, I would like that to still be the rule today. However, it is the methods of the "traditionalists" that I cannot agree with. Frankly, I have found the attitude of many quite disturbing. I also have to say that I have found just as much liberal condemnation against Paul VI and John Paul II for refusing to relent on contraception, reemphasizing Eucharistic adoration and refusing to give in on the women-priest issue.

In the church I grew up in, many people didn't know the official doctrines, absolutely no one agreed with all of them, everyone could pretty much make it up as they go, it was extremely nepotistic with every church being dominated by the pastor's family & relatives (who in some cases were my own kin) and what my friends in the Catholic Church told me was: our Church is the answer, the Catholic Church is Christ's Church, united by the Pope, protected from error by the Holy Spirit, carries on Christian truth regardless of passing trends, etc, etc.

Boy, does it look like I got it wrong. On another thread I was getting attacked on every side by an Orthodox and two Protestants for defending the Catholic Church, and I kept wondering why no one else was speaking up in defense of the Church. Now, I can see why, if even the Catholics no longer approve of the Catholic Church, the ship must be going down.