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To: Siobhan
***How do come to your conclusion that Jesus is, on occasion, refered to as the "Angel of the Lord" in the OT***

Based on context...


"But the angel of the LORD called out to him from heaven, "Abraham! Abraham!"
"Here I am," he replied.
"Do not lay a hand on the boy," he said. "Do not do anything to him. Now I know that you fear God, because you have not withheld from me your son, your only son."

...you have not withheld from ME...

Jesus appears in the OT in what are called "theophanies". God appearing in the form of a man or angel. It is up to the context of the passage to conclude where it is Jesus or not. Another example of Jesus appearing in a visible form is...


"The LORD appeared to Abraham near the great trees of Mamre while he was sitting at the entrance to his tent in the heat of the day. Abraham looked up and saw three men standing nearby. When he saw them, he hurried from the entrance of his tent to meet them and bowed low to the ground.... Then the LORD said, "I will surely return to you about this time next year, and Sarah your wife will have a son."

Angel in Hebrew can mean something like "messenger" as opposed to just a winged, celestial creature. Jesus, on occasion acts as God's messenger in thr OT. In the NT he is God's messenger Par Excellent!

80 posted on 03/15/2004 8:47:31 PM PST by PetroniusMaximus
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To: PetroniusMaximus
But how can you claim this is Jesus. There is no textual identification. I can understand your wanting this to be Jesus. I can understand your wanting Jesus to be the messenger. But the messenger in the New Testament in Luke's account of the Gospel is clearly the angel named Gabriel. So these then could be the appearances of the angel of the Lord named Gabriel. Or from other accounts, the angel of the Lord Michael.

Apart from your wishing it to be Jesus, and your belief in Jesus as the most excellent messenger (and don't get me wrong -- I agree with the belief) -- but I still don't see how you get that from Scripture alone. I see how your desires, your longing, your hopes, your faith, all enter into that opinion. But not the Bible alone.

Now if you are Eastern Orthodox or Roman Catholic your position makes perfect sense since theophany is an essential category for understanding these Scriptural events. But how do you come by the use of the term "theophany"? Have I missed something here and you are a denominational Christian that isn't a BIble alone Christian? If so, please excuse my prattling on. But if you are a Bible only Christian, I am at a loss to understand how you have come to these things and who has taught you.

83 posted on 03/15/2004 8:57:54 PM PST by Siobhan (+Pray the Divine Mercy Chaplet+)
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