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To: Destro; Aliska; All
The biggest arguments against a fraud, however, are not the testimonies of the shifting patriarchs.

"The biggest challenges confronting the critics are the thousands of independent testimonies by pilgrims whose candles were lit spontaneously in front of their eyes without any possible explanation. According to our investigations, it has never been possible to film any of the candles or oillamps igniting by themselves. However, I am in the possession of a video filmed by a young engineer from Bethlehem, Souhel Nabdiel. Mr. Nabdiel has been present at the ceremony of the Holy Fire since his early childhood. In 1996 he was asked to film the ceremony from the balcony of the dome of the Church. Present with him on the balcony were a nun and four other believers. The nun stood at the right hand of Nabdiel. On the video one can see how he films down on the crowds. At a certain point all lights are turned off – it is time for the Patriarch to enter the tomb and take the Holy Fire. While he is still inside the tomb one suddenly hears a scream of surprise and wonder originating from the nun standing next to Nabdiel. The camera begins to shake, as one hears the excited voices of the other people present on the balcony. The camera now turns to the right, whereby it is possible to contemplate the cause of the emotion. A big candle, held in the hand of the Russian nun, takes fire in front of all people present before the patriarch comes out of the tomb. With shaking hands she holds the candle while over and over making the sign of the Cross in awe of the potent she has witnessed. This video appears to be the closest one gets to an actual filming of the miracle."

And into infinity could I continue to post writings such as these to "support" the truth of the miracle. It is only the choice of which writing to believe, in the end. So what is the point of posting them at all? And specifically what (or who) motivates those who feel a need to discredit the Holy Fire?
I leave you to continue the discussion without my contributions, because you will certainly all come to agreement, based on your mutual reliance on "critical thinking" or science, or any one of the many other humanist idols of the west. :-)
May His peace be with you.

46 posted on 04/12/2004 12:36:11 PM PDT by MarMema
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To: MarMema; Aliska
It is true that sometimes the candles of the faithful are spontaneously lit before the Patriarch's. I think God's miracles are a mystery but I can't help but try and see how science is at play in all things. In a room with so many people, with moisture in the air from their breathing can create a conductive atmosphere of some sort?

In any case if it was as easy as lighting a match then the non-Orthodox would have lost the ceremony to the other denominations who would have picked up on said trick and made it their own or exposed it for a fraud long ago. Since many of these denominations are extremly hostile to the Orthodoxm I doubt they would waste the opportunity to do so.

53 posted on 04/12/2004 7:05:24 PM PDT by Destro (Know your enemy! Help fight Islamic terrorism by visiting www.johnathangaltfilms.com)
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