The Need for Reformation In The Southern Baptist Convention

Founders.org ^ | 2003 | Unknown

[Lexinom]

A search on the King James text from the NT, from www.holybible.com's search page shows 23 instances of the word "hell", of which the great majority are uttered by the Lord. Eliminating parallel duplicates from the Gospels relating the same events, I come out with about ten.

Ten references to this doctrine by our Lord tells us there is a place for preaching on Hell. True conviction comes with a true fear of the Lord, contrition of heart, and often accompanies true conversion (the life-changing kind).

It must be preached gently, with all humility, and with seriousness, conviction, and love. I've read accounts that state Jonathan Edwards delivered "Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God" in a monotone. In light of the many discussions on worship style here on FR I will say this: the climate in a congregation accustomed to giggling every few seconds as the pastor sprinkles a continuous stream of jokes undermines the efficacy of a sermon on a very serious subject. For the pastor, this:

I preached as never sure to preach again,
And as a dying man to dying men.
-Richard Baxter

[HarleyD]

"Sort of like Jesus preaching parables?"

The only difference between our Lord Jesus' parables and the modernist parables is our Lord Jesus' were divinely inspired with a great spiritual truth. The modernist parables come down as nothing more then Aesop's fables with a great moral truth.

Few preachers, along with their congregation, can tell the difference anymore.

[HarleyD]

"...the climate in a congregation accustomed to giggling every few seconds as the pastor sprinkles a continuous stream of jokes undermines the efficacy of a sermon on a very serious subject."

What a great truth. How can non-Christians take the salvation experience seriously if Christians do not present it seriously?

[connectthedots]

In light of the many discussions on worship style here on FR I will say this: the climate in a congregation accustomed to giggling every few seconds as the pastor sprinkles a continuous stream of jokes undermines the efficacy of a sermon on a very serious subject.

I've never heard a 'continuous stream of jokes' in a non-calvinist preacher's sermon. In fact, I recall a thread or two in which GRPL members insisted Calvinists have a sense of humor. Is that a trait their preachers do not possess?

[Revelation 911]

uncomfortable about nothin lex - Jesus is the rock
I just get tired of systematic cranky types painting Him with a consistent bad attitude when Christ shows otherwise
FWIW Our flock hears both - were not just tickling ears despite what you'd hear around here

[Revelation 911]

you can be a snip sometimes doc

[Revelation 911]

harley - why do you continually ping me?

[Lexinom]

Eccl. 4

[Lexinom]

3 rather

[CourtneyLeigh]

Oh My Word!

My family and I visited (first time) a local Pentacostal Church for a special service. Just to visit with friends, right! I'd always heard of these "Holy Rollers", Blood, sweat and tears services.
Yeah right, even this "old fashioned" church was very contemporary, very New Age, very user friendly.

I'm one of those people that believes kids and parents should sit together in service, and not be separated by pews or classes. And their teens were wearing very TIGHT shirts and jeans. And these weren't overweight children (big people have hard time finding comfortable fitting clothes)! This was very frustrating to my family, for it's hard to enjoy fellowship with other "Believers" without being distracted by their bulging body parts!
How many of you know what I'm talking about?

This is not a congregation I felt comfortable in. The pastor was distracting with his back seat comments during the guest preachers presentation. My mother and I both believe that Jesus was not present in that place, rather, the pastors "self" was looked up to!

There were dozens of times I felt lead by the spirit to walk out, or stand up and confront their "show" with Scripture!

[CourtneyLeigh]

True conviction comes with a true fear of the Lord, contrition of heart, and often accompanies true conversion (the life-changing kind).

>>Hell's Best Kept Secrets!
by Ray Comfort (www.livingwaters.com)

Personally, it was the Lord that rescued my falling heart thru the ministry of this man, who is not afraid to preach: Fire, Brimstone, Hell, and Repent, Live by the Ten Commandments, respect the Law of God!
I apologize for "solicitating" an evangelist/preacher, everyone has a favorite or special minister in their heart. Ray & his humble testimonies, and successful stories of streetside preaching have been a strengthening rod in my life. Reminding me to be proud of God's Word, proud of the fear I have in my heart of an "Angry God, proud - but in a discerningly grateful way!

Hell's best kept secrets, are those False preachers & False Leaders
You know how cute those lion cubs are, until they become fierce -n- hungry stalking lions! Just like temptations, and Lucifer. Satan comes as a Wolf in Sheeps clothing, He is the Lion inside the cub, He lurks around seeking Whom He MAY DEVOUR. Satan is like the lady spoken of in Proverbs, she is like a piece of bread to a starving man, She tempts him!

Hells best kept secrets is the sermon that doesn't minister even one shameful face, that doesn't burn even one convictable sin, it is the "Evangelist" that doesn't disciple those that are converted under the Lords ministry through him!

These are Hells best kept secrets!

[CourtneyLeigh]

Few preachers, along with their congregation, can tell the difference anymore

Amen to that!

[CourtneyLeigh]

suh-weet-er.

Absolutely deserves a DITTO! on my part!

[hiredhand]

We should be filled with an an uneasy peace whenever we hear a sermon that tells us what we want to hear. Even a sermon that takes us into full worship should convict us of our shortcomings and put into complete perspective WHERE we are, as opposed to WHERE we will be....and until we dwell with God, beware of those who tickle the ears and tell us everything is O.K.

Some of my biggest pet peaves are the doctrine of prosperity, and this "I'm O.K....You're O.K....we're all children of YHVH" nonesense....which is flatly refuted both in the old and new Testaments.

We're in the midst of a global conflict. Just because nobody wants to talk about it, or admit it doesn't make it any less true....and it's largely a (and I loathe this term) a "religeous war. Essential, it boils down to Jews, and Christians against everybody else.

Why does the absolute and raw truth cut people so badly? It's no wonder they threw Jeremiah into a pit, and sawed Isiah in half. They couldn't stand themselves when their godlessness was contrasted against the simple righteous words spoken by the prophets on behalf of Adonai.

...and yet, they don't realize that they rebel against Adonai, but rather believe in their hearts that they have rightfully killed an unjust person...when in fact, they bring the judgement of the Lord by what they do.

Anybody can tell us things that we WANT to hear, but it takes a courageous friend to try to help by telling us things that we DON'T want to hear....so much that some are will to kill on account of it!

[Dr. Eckleburg]

I thought we had gotten past calling each other names.

[Lexinom]

A good way to divide the Christian experience is thus: guilt, grace, and gratitude. All three elements must - MUST - come through in sound preaching. The strict schoolmaster of the law drives the penitent to their knees. It also hardens some

Some of my biggest pet peaves are the doctrine of prosperity, and this "I'm O.K....You're O.K....we're all children of YHVH" nonesense....which is flatly refuted both in the old and new Testaments.

We are all our own little gods by nature. Recall that pride was the devil's first sin, the one he kindled in the hearts of our first parents - who, having truly free, unbonded will at the time, did capitulate and drag the entire human race into ruin. Endemic is the desire for "more stuff" - the central theme (dare I use the word "dogma"?) of the movement you mentioned.

We're in the midst of a global conflict. Just because nobody wants to talk about it, or admit it doesn't make it any less true....and it's largely a (and I loathe this term) a "religeous war. Essential, it boils down to Jews, and Christians against everybody else.

Yes, precisely. Humanism is a religion, complete with its own creeds. It tries to don the mantle of the nonreligion. It pays homage to men like Marx and Engels, whose ideas have caused more unnecessary bloodshed than any others. It sacrifices the sanctity of life on the unholy altar of science falsely so-called. It is the official state religion according to the judicial branch of the United States government. Its proponents defend it on the hallowed grounds of separation of church and state (itself a widely misunderstood context give the historical context) combined with the fact that Humanism claims to be the "nonreligion" in this sense: There is no God, therefore man is the center and all philosophy must proceed from him. Kant popularized this anthropocentric epistomology.

The other religions, each showing some sliver of the broad spectrum God's nonredemptive common grace to all creatures, must needs oppose the one that excludes them. "I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me." John 4:6 [KJV].

Enough of my pedagogical ranting; you made some excellent points hh.

[hiredhand]

A good way to divide the Christian experience is thus: guilt, grace, and gratitude.

Wow...that's a good way to put it! I truly never thought about it that way. I'd say more, but I'm about whooped and was supposed to be in bed over 3 hours ago.

:-)

[Lexinom]

That is a division for which I do not deserve credit. Would that I had the Spirit-guided wisdom of the 27-year-old Zacharias Ursinus, but it was he who thus divided the experience in the most beautiful, the most intimate, the most treasured of Reformed creeds, the Heidelberg Catechism.

It sums up what the Bible teaches in a way that I can die with, and completely guided by Scripture. God through his servant Peter commanded me to always have an answer for the reason of the hope that is within me. The HC is an indispensible tool, something I can die with in comfort.

I, too must now rest. Ps. 127, my FRiend.

[CourtneyLeigh]

Yes, precisely. Humanism is a religion, complete with its own creeds. It tries to don the mantle of the nonreligion

C'mon guys, call it what it is:

Paganism!

[Lexinom]

Let me say with all humility that this indicts every one of us, apart from the grace of God through Jesus Christ. We are no better than they, yet the battle must yet be waged. We are on the winning side.

Mark 13:26 [KJV] And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory.

Something looming ominously, darkly on the horizon, is a day when Christians will be openly persecuted. We've seen the germinal stages of this with the misuse of "separation of church and states" exemplified in the case against Judge Roy Moore and the Ten Commandments.

Next will come hate crimes as Christians denounce abortion and sodomarriage. Ministers will be accountable to the ICC in The Hague. This will be a great and terrible trial for the Bride of Christ.

My dear brothers and sisters, are we ready to die for what we believe? Do we believe what we say strongly enough? May God grant us wise use of these fleeting hours freedom we've been given, to study diligently. May we be given to pray for one another (yes, even those whose faces we've never seen), for God's strength.