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Oakland seminary housing sex offender priests
ABC News ^ | November 28, 2004

Posted on 11/30/2004 3:10:06 PM PST by AskStPhilomena

If you attend one of the daily services at St. Albert's seminary in the Rockridge neighborhood, you probably wouldn't expect to be sitting next to several sex offenders. But, that's often the case. The Dominican Order of Catholic Priests has decided to send its members who've abused children across the western United States to live at St. Albert's.

Former seminarian: "I think it's embarrassing for the church, it's a very sad statement on what can happen when people abuse power, when they abuse authority."

This former seminarian attended a meeting two years ago when St. Albert's officials announced sex offenders would be moving in, and that the young men training to be priests should tell no one – not their families, not the media.

(Excerpt) Read more at abclocal.go.com ...


TOPICS: Activism; Apologetics; Catholic; Current Events; Ministry/Outreach; Moral Issues; Religion & Culture; Religion & Politics
KEYWORDS: catholic; crisis; sodomite
So much for zero tolerance
1 posted on 11/30/2004 3:10:06 PM PST by AskStPhilomena
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To: Land of the Irish; ultima ratio; Salvation; NYer; bornacatholic; thor76; Unam Sanctam; murphE; ...

Related.....
http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/news/iteam/112904_iteam_seminary.html


2 posted on 11/30/2004 3:11:56 PM PST by AskStPhilomena
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To: AskStPhilomena

This is shameless. And that priest keeps DEFENDING them!


3 posted on 11/30/2004 3:46:54 PM PST by reaganaut (Red state girl in a Blue state world (Socialist Republic of California))
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To: reaganaut

Sodomites and other sick perverts are being defended, nay even promoted up to the highest levels in the Vatican.


4 posted on 11/30/2004 3:51:12 PM PST by AskStPhilomena
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To: Canticle_of_Deborah; narses; Land of the Irish; ultima ratio; murphE; thor76

Update...
http://www.sffaith.com/ed/articles/2004/0411rk.htm


5 posted on 12/01/2004 6:14:16 PM PST by AskStPhilomena
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To: AskStPhilomena
Let's just shoot all the sex offending priests.

Would that make you traddies happy?

6 posted on 12/01/2004 6:27:15 PM PST by sinkspur ("It is a great day to be alive. I appreciate your gratitude." God Himself.)
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To: sinkspur; AskStPhilomena; Canticle_of_Deborah; Land of the Irish

"Let's just shoot all the sex offending priests."

That is the only sensible thing you have ever written on FR. And to do such a thing would make many happy, and would be justice.

"for one of you to corrupt one of these little ones, it would be better that you put a mill stone around you neck, and be cast into the sea".


7 posted on 12/01/2004 6:40:40 PM PST by thor76 (Vade retro, Draco! Crux sacra sit mihi lux! St. Michael the Archangel defend us in battle!)
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To: sinkspur
Let's just shoot all the sex offending priests.

Castration is good enough for me.

Start with the Cardinals and work your way down.

8 posted on 12/01/2004 6:45:57 PM PST by Land of the Irish (Tradidi quod et accepi)
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To: sinkspur
Let's just shoot all the sex offending priests.

Castration is good enough for me.

Start with the Cardinals and work your way down.

9 posted on 12/01/2004 6:47:15 PM PST by Land of the Irish (Tradidi quod et accepi)
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To: thor76; ninenot
That is the only sensible thing you have ever written on FR. And to do such a thing would make many happy, and would be justice.

Next, let's draw a bead on abortion doctors. Then we could work our way over to active homosexuals.

How about marking a bullet or two for adulterers, or fornicators?

I noticed that Billy Sol Hargis died on Monday. His hellfire-and-brimstone spirit lives in the raddie-traddies of Free Republic.

In a serious vein, the Church has to house these abusers somewhere; they can't be turned loose in society, or the Church is liable. Conservative Bishop Alan Vigneron (who has been praised as a hero on FR) has given his OK.

What is your realistic proposition?

10 posted on 12/01/2004 6:54:38 PM PST by sinkspur ("It is a great day to be alive. I appreciate your gratitude." God Himself.)
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To: sinkspur

We are all sinners. How convenient it is to judge some as more sinful than others. When we can stop and remember how sinful we are, we are less able to point fingers and judge others.


11 posted on 12/01/2004 7:09:35 PM PST by MarMema
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To: MarMema
The downside I see here is that the rector of the seminary or the bishop did not notify authorities.

It's the law in most states that local police are to be notified when sex offenders move into a neighborhood.

12 posted on 12/01/2004 7:11:16 PM PST by sinkspur ("It is a great day to be alive. I appreciate your gratitude." God Himself.)
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To: sinkspur; thor76
What is your realistic proposition?

How about JAIL?

Or if the statute of limitations for prosecution has run out, how about a far away cloistered monastery where they can do penance for the rest of their days, far away from the faithful, and far away from new seminarians.

That's just 2 off the top of my head.

13 posted on 12/01/2004 7:15:25 PM PST by murphE (fight terrorism in the womb END ABORTION NOW)
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To: murphE
Or if the statute of limitations for prosecution has run out, how about a far away cloistered monastery where they can do penance for the rest of their days, far away from the faithful, and far away from new seminarians.

The Dominicans are not a cloistered order. It's unlikely that Trappists would agree to disrupt their lives to take them.

Realities intrude, murphE.

14 posted on 12/01/2004 7:18:15 PM PST by sinkspur ("It is a great day to be alive. I appreciate your gratitude." God Himself.)
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To: AskStPhilomena
The only California bishop more unlucky than Vigneron will be Mahony's successor.
15 posted on 12/01/2004 8:36:30 PM PST by Canticle_of_Deborah
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To: murphE; Land of the Irish; Canticle_of_Deborah; AskStPhilomena

Your suggestion is both prudent, sane, and just.

They should be made to do penance for the rest of their lives, living on a bland and coarse diet, living in a simple, unadorned monastic setting. NO TV, radio, newspaper, computer, etc. Books> Sure......scripture, and the writings of saints and mystics. Music? the chant of the divine office, sung in common.

If they will not submit to this mercy for their souls, then they should be turned loose with no pension, medical insurance or salary. Let them beg the modernists who lov ethem so much for their bread then.


16 posted on 12/01/2004 8:38:53 PM PST by thor76 (Vade retro, Draco! Crux sacra sit mihi lux! St. Michael the Archangel defend us in battle!)
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To: Canticle_of_Deborah

The way the sacred college of cardinals is stacked, Mahony could be Pope John Paul 2's successor.
Compared to some of the wacko jackos in Europe and Africa, Mahony is probably considered a moderate.


17 posted on 12/01/2004 8:41:42 PM PST by AskStPhilomena
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To: AskStPhilomena; GatorGirl; maryz; afraidfortherepublic; Antoninus; Aquinasfan; livius; ...

Yeah, here in my Diocese (Spokane) the Bishop (and now President of the USCCB) keeps a convicted sex criminal as Parish Priest running a Catholic School and serving on the Diocesan School Board. Zero Tolerance? H.E. says he has never abused kids and is a 'fine priest'. The CHILD PORN found in his bedding? Well, he went for treatment. The conviction? Well, it was plead down to 'disorderly conduct'.

The USCCB is led by a man who KNOWINGLY allows a child porn user, a man convicted of sexual misconduct in a porn shop to be in charge of school kids. You tell me, is it getting better?


18 posted on 12/01/2004 10:00:07 PM PST by narses (Free Republic is pro-God, pro-life, pro-family + Vivo Christo Rey!)
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To: AskStPhilomena

Bite your tongue. Demons are summoned by the sound of their name.

St. Padre Pio, Pray for us.


19 posted on 12/01/2004 10:01:42 PM PST by narses (Free Republic is pro-God, pro-life, pro-family + Vivo Christo Rey!)
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To: thor76

**They should be made to do penance for the rest of their lives, living on a bland and coarse diet, living in a simple, unadorned monastic setting. NO TV, radio, newspaper, computer, etc. Books> Sure......scripture, and the writings of saints and mystics. Music? the chant of the divine office, sung in common.**

Right here http://www.chartreux.org/maisons/Transfiguration/Transfiguration.htm


20 posted on 12/01/2004 10:07:14 PM PST by Canticle_of_Deborah ((www.stopthreadnannies.com))
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To: narses

"You tell me, is it getting better?"

No, it's only getting worse.
Unfortunately, just like Jeffrey Dahmer in jail, many of the misfits masquerading as Catholic bishops continue to receive fan-mail...
http://condoms4life.org/news/2004/113004GoodShepherd.htm


21 posted on 12/01/2004 10:08:06 PM PST by AskStPhilomena
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To: sinkspur

Hey Deacon, your thoughts?


22 posted on 12/01/2004 10:19:27 PM PST by narses (Free Republic is pro-God, pro-life, pro-family + Vivo Christo Rey!)
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To: AskStPhilomena

Tell me about it. Ugh.


23 posted on 12/01/2004 10:20:28 PM PST by narses (Free Republic is pro-God, pro-life, pro-family + Vivo Christo Rey!)
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To: narses; sinkspur

The deacon probably still believes the bishops' lies about "zero tolerance".


24 posted on 12/01/2004 10:55:13 PM PST by AskStPhilomena
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To: AskStPhilomena

**the young men training to be priests should tell no one – not their families, not the media.**

Yikes! These poor young men -- not a good place to be.


25 posted on 12/01/2004 11:15:46 PM PST by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
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To: thor76

Hate the sin, love the sinner.


26 posted on 12/01/2004 11:16:51 PM PST by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
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To: sinkspur; livius; chemicalman; Notwithstanding; PadreL; nickcarraway; NYer; Polycarp IV; ninenot; ..
A person cannot really categorize priests and/or seminarians like this article does.

Here are some other articles about seminarians:
Cardinal Arinze - "Youth will embrace religious life with right role models"

Today's seminarians reflect growing trend

Number of Seminarians Increases - Please Decipher This!!!!

In Seminaries, New Ways for a New Generation

Seminary Springtime: Father Darrin Connall s Big Success

EVIDENCE GROWS OF DIRECT DISOBEDIENCE TO VATICAN IN MAJOR AMERICAN SEMINARIES

Pope to Church: Risky Seminarians Must Go

Priests Down, Seminarians Up

U.S. Priests and seminarians survey: more vocations in orthodox dioceses

Vatican Announces Surge in Seminaries during JPII Pontificate

Seminary Reform Needed in Wake of Sex Abuse Study ["the crisis in the Church is ... homosexuality"]

Homosexuals in seminaries? The latest.....

Priests 'In Orgy' at Seminary

Bishop urges gay ban in clergy; presses for overhaul in screening priests

A New Breed of Priest

AUSTRIAN SEMINARY SHUT DOWN FOR PROBE

Seminarians Show Support For Celibacy

556 Reasons for Hope [Seminarians Support Celibacy]

Oakland seminary housing sex offender priests

27 posted on 12/01/2004 11:23:41 PM PST by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
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To: Salvation

I am not quite sure what your point is........or whether you actually read what I wrote in its entirety.

But if the sodomite priest is sent to a monastary for hard labor, silence, prayer, penance, and enforced poverty, it is for the good of his soul.

Let me say that again for the hard of hearing: it is for the good of his soul!


28 posted on 12/01/2004 11:34:19 PM PST by thor76 (Vade retro, Draco! Crux sacra sit mihi lux! St. Michael the Archangel defend us in battle!)
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To: sinkspur; m4629
You did make some good points,the principal one being,what are we to do with offenders? Although certainly they could have alerted the neighborhood. Unfortunately,the Church still does not have a good handle on some major problems that are an outgrowth of the abuse. And even more to the shame of the body of B/bishops,they deny the major problem which they do have a handle on.

Complment time is now over and I would like some source of the pronouncement you made about Vigneron's knowledge of the existence of the abusers at St. Albert's and some evidence that if he does know,he approves and further that he has the authority to order an Order to acquiesce to him.

29 posted on 12/01/2004 11:57:22 PM PST by saradippity
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To: AskStPhilomena

Hi AskStPhilomena.


30 posted on 12/02/2004 12:01:38 AM PST by fatima (Pray for our troops.I voted for tomkow6,Change your tagline now Petronski.)
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To: thor76

Get lost.


31 posted on 12/02/2004 12:12:45 AM PST by fatima (Pray for our troops.I voted for tomkow6,Change your tagline now Petronski.)
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To: sinkspur

I suspect that the USCC puzzle-palace headquarters in Washington DC could be sold for a tidy sum--which could then be re-invested in a nice secure semi-fortress desert monestary someplace in the USA.

Two birds, one stone. We could even keep some USCC staffers as "guards."


32 posted on 12/02/2004 4:41:01 AM PST by ninenot (Minister of Membership, TomasTorquemadaGentlemen'sClub)
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To: ninenot; BlackElk
I suspect that the USCC puzzle-palace headquarters in Washington DC could be sold for a tidy sum--which could then be re-invested in a nice secure semi-fortress desert monestary someplace in the USA. Two birds, one stone. We could even keep some USCC staffers as "guards."

Excellent idea!  You're always thinking, and thinking straight; that's why yours and the General's posts are reliably good reads.

Pax et bonum FRiends!
33 posted on 12/02/2004 4:47:16 AM PST by GirlShortstop
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To: saradippity
Complment time is now over and I would like some source of the pronouncement you made about Vigneron's knowledge of the existence of the abusers at St. Albert's and some evidence that if he does know,he approves and further that he has the authority to order an Order to acquiesce to him.

Go to the link, read the article, especially the last paragraph.

34 posted on 12/02/2004 5:46:59 AM PST by sinkspur ("It is a great day to be alive. I appreciate your gratitude." God Himself.)
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To: saradippity; GirlShortstop; narses; Canticle_of_Deborah
If anyone cares, I know St. Albert's Priory. You walk out the front door and in no time you are on top of a school. Walk straight on and you are at a supermarket and a number of stores. And there are upscale homes all around it. The Priory used to be a Convent as I recall.

Many of the Dominicans are stalwart, some are enemies of God. Those in command despise Bishop Vigneron -- and let's be clear, Bishop Vigneron could not stop the Dominicans from doing this. The idea of planting all of these creatures in Vigneron's diocese was no doubt a great joy to a number of the boys in white at St. Albert's and in the Western Province.

Oh well....

35 posted on 12/02/2004 7:34:16 AM PST by Siobhan (Where is there justice in the gate...)
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To: sinkspur; Canticle_of_Deborah; AskStPhilomena
Thanks,I read both links St. Phil put up as well as one from Canticle of Deborah. I don't put a lot of stock in the last sentence of the first link.

First of all the offenders were placed at the priory one year before Vigneron arrived in Oakland and it may have been some while after he arrived before he was apprised of the situation. Second,Fr.Corales(sp?),was being interviewed and was on the hot seat,sounds like he threw the Bishop's 'blessing' into the mix and hoped no one would check it out. And since it did not seem to be a direct quote,he may have just said:"the bishop know about this arrangement". Third,the Bishop was not interviewed because he was out of town.

So thankyou for providing your source,and there was a reason for you to say what you did,I myself put little stock in the truth of the specifics regards Vigneron's position and actions in this case at this time.

36 posted on 12/02/2004 8:30:04 AM PST by saradippity
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To: Siobhan
Thanks for the input. In one of the linked articles,it shows that the use of the Priory for offenders far predated Vigneron's coming to Oakland and I bet they kept it a secret as long as possible.

This is a little off topic but you always know so much so I have a question for you.I have asked this question on a regular basis and never got a response,or if I did I didn't see it or worse.

Do you know if any Bishops tried using exorcists to try to remove the "demonic" presence from the abusive priests? I believe the Vatican's official exorcist,Fr. Amworth says that that demon is particulary difficult to remove,so I infer that it has been tried. If it has,(especially in the 50's and 60's)and if it was considered successful,wouldn't you like to know about it? I know I would,it would certainly add a new dimension to the discussions.

37 posted on 12/02/2004 8:43:01 AM PST by saradippity
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To: sinkspur; MarMema

The downside I see here is the proximity of homosexual perverts to young seminarians.


38 posted on 12/02/2004 9:15:12 AM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilisation is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: narses
Demons are summoned by the sound of their name.

Now that takes me back to my Dungeons & Dragons days ... < roll 10 sided dice ... >

39 posted on 12/02/2004 9:17:51 AM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilisation is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: saradippity

I would like for Fr. Amorth to say more on the matter so we can move beyond the "official story" regarding so-called 'sexual orientation'. I have heard of stories, sara, but only stories.


40 posted on 12/02/2004 10:48:14 AM PST by Siobhan (Where is there justice in the gate...)
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To: saradippity; Siobhan
Do you know if any Bishops tried using exorcists to try to remove the "demonic" presence from the abusive priests?

Most of the bishops do not believe in the devil (or are on his side--sorry, it's true). There may be a few but the US has fewer than 10 exorcists at last count. Most of the bishops put the false god of modern psychology before any thought of demonic temptation, let alone possession.

I know of one case in California where the bishop refuses to help a man with a very bad obsession despite the Catholic psychologist's outright pleas to the bishop for assistance.

41 posted on 12/02/2004 10:48:17 AM PST by Canticle_of_Deborah ((www.stopthreadnannies.com))
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To: Canticle_of_Deborah
I know of one case in California where the bishop refuses to help a man with a very bad obsession despite the Catholic psychologist's outright pleas to the bishop for assistance.


St. John Fisher, pray for us!

42 posted on 12/02/2004 10:52:14 AM PST by Pyro7480 (Sub tuum praesidium confugimus, sancta Dei Genitrix.... sed a periculis cunctis libera nos semper...)
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To: Siobhan

Sorry, meant to ping you on my last post.


43 posted on 12/02/2004 10:52:58 AM PST by Pyro7480 (Sub tuum praesidium confugimus, sancta Dei Genitrix.... sed a periculis cunctis libera nos semper...)
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To: saradippity

What you said about the concept of exorcising the "demonic presence" from the abusive priests is quite interesting. Even more so is what Fr. Amorth said. Any more info in this?


44 posted on 12/02/2004 10:54:31 AM PST by thor76 (Vade retro, Draco! Crux sacra sit mihi lux! St. Michael the Archangel defend us in battle!)
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To: Pyro7480

Oh St. John Fisher, pray for us, pray for us!


45 posted on 12/02/2004 10:58:42 AM PST by Siobhan (Where is there justice in the gate...)
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To: Siobhan

Even before my trip to England a few months ago, I loved to read about the English martyrs. But after I came back, I've come to really respect and revere these brave souls. In this time, we need more souls of their kind.


46 posted on 12/02/2004 11:00:37 AM PST by Pyro7480 (Sub tuum praesidium confugimus, sancta Dei Genitrix.... sed a periculis cunctis libera nos semper...)
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To: saradippity

I hope you haven't given up your idea of exiling them to Penguin Island : )


47 posted on 12/02/2004 2:29:14 PM PST by eastsider
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To: eastsider
Never fear. Of course I would never give up my Penguin Isle exile Program for contrite abusers,found guilty of a certain level of abuse. And,I have designed a couple of other alternative programs.

Others,who may be less contrite,would be destined for my second Program,which calls for a life sentence spent in an old seminary in the Badlands staffed by an order of feminazi nuns.

The third Program is reserved for bishops who covered for abusers and/or abused themselves. I developed the plan based on some of the liturgy documents I have read;it calls for maximum public participation which I understand is very important. Although the program has to be fleshed out,the idea is to buy a couple of engines and quite a few open air cattle cars,encased in barbed wire.

Then we load them up with bishops dressed only in skivies and send it from city to city via the railroad system. We place ads in the paper so that all know the bishops will be at the train depot certain days and the public can come down and boo,hoot,hiss and throw small sopping wet sponges at them. I kind of hear that song "The Man Who Never Returned" coming across the speaker system night and day,forever.

Island,seminary,engines,boxcars,,staffs,seed,lumber can be paid for from the proceeds of the sale of the fancy digs the USCCB now own.

Of course this would all take place after the jail sentences,if the statute of limitations has run out. None of these programs can be implemented until the bishops or the committee release the information regards the number and degree of abuse. I refuse to be a party to applying either zero tolerance or equal punishment to men whose crimes or sins may have ranged from looking at someone funny,through thwacking bare butts with a towel after team showers to genital contact with an eight year old.

48 posted on 12/02/2004 8:33:40 PM PST by saradippity
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To: AskStPhilomena
I'm not sure I like the idea of concentrating them all in one place. Not only for the sake of the community but also for their own sakes. They have critical mass in a community like this. That could work to the good but it could just as easily lead to further problems. I think each one needs to be isolated and placed in the personal care of a holy spiritual director ( if such can be found) and put on a round the clock watch, or the spiritual version thereof. Some may simply need to be incarcerated the way any sex offender would.

I note with disgust the following paragraph:

Father Roberto Corral: "These guys have been through their therapy, and working with their counselors and therapists, we are reasonably sure they will not re-offend."

Father, if secular shrinks are all the Church has to fight this problem, then we are in bad shape. Sins of the flesh are impervious to psychoanalysis, intellectual rationalizing, group discussions and pep rally psychology.

They don't listen. They have a life all of their own and only Divine grace can overcome them.

If this is the only treatment these men have received I'll bet my next pay-check that many of them will re-offend if the opportunity arises.

49 posted on 12/02/2004 9:12:03 PM PST by marshmallow
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