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To: jdhighness

hmm... You sum up my feelings pretty well with Pinker. I'm not sure - it is what it is. I think it is an interesting way to view it, but that yes, despite the innate problems with human expression, more is better then less. I am not neccesarily sure if Ebonics type language is always in conflict with this or not.

Of course, I think I agree with Pinker over the 'holded' and 'held' idea - needless complication that doesn't convey any more accurate meaning.

You state the following:
"I would attempt to maximize my pleasure here on earth, even at other people's expense."

I think such actions would bring you the exact opposite of what you desire - here on earth.
This is another excerpt:


In cases where an individual chooses not to follow God's will the situation can turn tragic. Struggling against the will of God is most difficult because everything around them is likely moving with God, while he/she stands alone. In the name of short term pleasure, sadistic delight, or the thrill of a power trip, this individual will spiral down into a well of rage, hate, malice, and insanity. Near their end, it is reported that Hitler and Stalin suffered severe psychological breakdown and bouts of depression, anxieties, and nervous ticks. (43), (44) Henry XVIII, Nero, Hermann Goering, Saddam Hussein, Uday Hussein, Ali Hassan al-Majid (Chemical Ali), Charles Mason, and Pol Pot have all been described as, delusional, raging, depressed, and mad. (45), (46) Indeed, all evil men (and women) eventually destroy themselves. Yet, many will kindle a fire and consume themselves. (Isaiah 26:11) What comes out of a man is what makes him 'unclean'. For from within, out of men's hearts, come evil thoughts, sexual immorality, theft, murder, adultery, greed, malice, deceit, lewdness, envy, slander, arrogance, and folly. All of these evils come from inside and make a man 'unclean'. (Mark 7:7) Those unrelentingly cruel ones, objects of compassion, Maddened by delusion's evils, wantonly destroy themselves and others. (47) (Tenzin Gyatso) We have great compassion for them, because they do not know the truth. They destroy Buddhism-they destroy themselves. (48) (Maha Ghosananda)

Or, perhaps it is better said that they chose to be destroyed by God?

They encourage wickedness in an evil matter: they commune of laying snares privily; they say, Who shall see them? They search out iniquities; they accomplish a diligent search: both the inward thought of every one of them, and the heart, is deep. But God shall shoot at them with an arrow; suddenly shall they be wounded. So they shall make their own tongue to fall upon wickedness: all that see them shall flee away. (Psalms 51-75)

Lo, this is the man that made not God his strength; but trusted in the abundance of his riches, and strengthened himself in his wickedness. Let death seize upon them, and let them go down quick into hell: for wickedness is in their dwellings, and among them.Yea, in heart ye work wickedness; ye weigh the violence of your hands in the earth. Psalms (51-75)

What do heaven and hell really represent? They are said not to be physical substances and not be present on Earth. We have established that Consciousness shares these qualities. It is clear that good compassionate deeds bring forth their own reward and evil deeds sow their own pain and misery. Perhaps Heaven and Hell, as defined as such, are being experienced in real time. In thinking about our true fate after death we must abandon rationality and work off faith.


75 posted on 01/24/2005 9:46:24 AM PST by traviskicks (http://www.neoperspectives.com/blackconservatism.htm)
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To: traviskicks

Very well researched and I agree for some pleasures.

What really intriqued me at first about Christianity was its absolute discipline in all areas of life, including even thought! That we could be judged on thoughts intimated that this religion had to have objective backing or else NO ONE would choose it.

Another thing about Christianity is the prohibition on enjoying one of our most basic drives: sex. It is so easy to achieve, so pleasurable (in theory for me), and so easy to rationalize away with today's culture. Yet we are still to keep it highly restricted under Christ. That, I think would be a deal breaker if there ever was one.

If you believe the consciousness lives beyond death, then hell would be separation from the Creator who created the universe and consciousness. Though I agree that many people who experienced a hell on earth, sadly, are now separated from God for eternity. To me eternal isolation in the "outer darkness" as Jesus puts it seems intolerable for only a short time, much less an eternity. That, at first, was a primary motivation to accelerate Christianizing my life.

Sorry if that ran on a bit! I do enjoy talking with you.


80 posted on 01/24/2005 5:07:39 PM PST by jdhighness
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