Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

To: snarks_when_bored

The following explains the correct Catholic concept of obedience as it has been taught for 2000 years.

-------


OBEDIENCE AND THE FAITH
It is the teaching of the Church that obedience is part of justice, one of the four cardinal virtues, which are in turn subordinate to the theological virtues of faith, hope, and charity. Faith is greater than obedience! Therefore, if obedience acts to harm the faith, than a Catholic has a duty not to obey his superior.

"Now sometimes the things commanded by a superior are against God, therefore superiors are not to be obeyed in all things." -- St. Thomas Aquinas, Doctor of the Church, Summa Theologica II-IIQ. 104

"But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach a gospel to you besides that which we have preached to you, let him be anathema." -- Galatians 1:8


According to the great theologian, St. Thomas Aquinas, true obedience is a balance between twin errors of defect and excess, which are disobedience and false obedience (IIa IIae, Q104, 5 and 3). Today this second error is common among Catholics who, when they follow orders to depart from Tradition, think they are being obedient.

Where there is a proximate danger to the faith, prelates must be rebuked, even publicly, by subjects. Thus, St. Paul who was subject to St. Peter, rebuked him publicly. --St. Thomas Aquinas, Commentary on the Epistle to the Galatians 2:14

We ought to obey God...rather than men. -- Acts 5:29

And there is no reason why those who obey God rather than men should be accused of refusing obedience; for if the will of rulers is opposed to the will and the laws of God, these rulers exceed the bounds of their own power and pervert justice, nor can their authority then be valid, which, when there is no justice, is null. -- Leo XIII, Diuturnum Illud.

----

Contrast the above teachings with those found in Msgr. Escriva's "The Way".

Maxim 61: Whenever a layman sets himself up as an arbiter of morality, he frequently errs; laymen can only be disciples.

Maxim 941: Obedience, the sure way. Blind obedience to your superior, the way of sanctity. Obedience in your apostolate, the only way: for, in a work of God, the spirit must be to obey or to leave.

Excerpt from "Studies on The Way" -- At that time, The Way prepared millions of people to come into harmony with, and to imbibe, on a deep level, some of the most revolutionary teachings which thirty years later would be solemnly promulgated by the Church at Vatican II.

----

The quotes directly above point to a clear break with the traditional teaching of the Catholic Church on obedience. It is self admitted to be revolutionary and novel. It is therefore not Catholic.


(For it is a master-stroke of Satan to get Catholics to disobey the whole of Tradition in the name of obedience." --Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre)


23 posted on 01/29/2005 11:59:01 PM PST by Canticle_of_Deborah
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]


To: Canticle_of_Deborah
The quotes directly above point to a clear break with the traditional teaching of the Catholic Church on obedience. It is self admitted to be revolutionary and novel. It is therefore not Catholic.

But you are taking St. Josemaria out of context. For instance, here are some quotes from Conversations:

From the moment in which they first approach the Work, all its members are fully aware of their individual freedom. If one of them ever tried to exert pressure on the others to make them accept his political opinions, or to use them for human interests, they would rebel and expel him without a second thought.

Respect for its members' freedom is an essential condition of Opus Dei's very existence. Without it, no one would come to the Work. Even more. The Work has never intervened in politics and, with God's help it never will; but if it were to, I would be its number one enemy. (No. 28)

Not only because we associate exclusively for supernatural ends, but also because if a member of Opus Dei were to attempt to impose, directly or indirectly, a temporal criterion on the other members, or if he should try to make use of them for human ends, he would be expelled at once. For the other members would rebel and their rebellion would be legitimate and holy. (No. 39)

Opus Dei's directors can never impose a political or professional criterion on other members. If a member of the Work ever tried to do this, or to use other members of the Work for some human end, he would be expelled straightaway, because they would rise in legitimate rebellion. (No. 48)


28 posted on 01/30/2005 12:42:28 PM PST by gbcdoj ("The Pope orders, the cardinals do not obey, and the people do as they please" - Benedict XIV)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 23 | View Replies ]

To: Canticle_of_Deborah
(For it is a master-stroke of Satan to get Catholics to disobey the whole of Tradition in the name of obedience." --Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre)

* The master stroke of Satan is to convince Catholics that Tradition is preserved by Schism.

34 posted on 01/30/2005 1:37:17 PM PST by bornacatholic (Liberal traditionalists; the Neo-Protestants of our times)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 23 | View Replies ]

To: Canticle_of_Deborah
Thanks for the material you posted. It's clear that there's disagreement about what Escrivá meant by 'obedience'. Did he advocate 'enlightened obedience', meaning the obedience of a thinking, compassionate believer, or did he advocate 'blind obedience', meaning the obedience of a fascist's minion?

I ran across a letter he sent in 1958 to the fascist Spanish dictator, Franco. It's not especially damning, but neither is it especially reassuring:

To his Excellency Franciso Franco Bahamonde, Head of State of Spain

Your Excellency:

I wish to add my sincerest personal congratulation to the many you have received on the occasion of the promulgation of the Fundamental Principles.

My forced absence from our homeland in service of God and souls, far from weakening my love for Spain, has, if it were possible, increased it. From the perspective of the eternal city of Rome, I have been able to see better than ever the beauty of that especially beloved daughter of the church which is my homeland, which the Lord has so often used as an instrument for the defense and propagation of the holy, Catholic faith in the world.

Although alien to any political activity, I cannot help but rejoice as a priest and Spaniard that the Chief of State’s authoritative voice should proclaim that, “The Spanish nation considers it a badge of honor to accept the law of God according to the one and true doctrine of the Holy Catholic Church, inseparable faith of the national conscience which will inspire its legislation.” It is in fidelity to our people’s Catholic tradition that the best guarantee of success in acts of government, the certainty of a just and lasting peace within the national community, as well as the divine blessing for those holding positions of authority, will always be found.

I ask God our Lord to bestow upon your Excellency with every sort felicity and impart abundant grace to carry out the grave mission entrusted to you.

Please accept, Excellency, the expression of my deepest personal esteem and be assured of my prayers for all your family.

Most devotedly yours in the Lord,
Josemaría Escrivá de Balaguer
Rome, May 23, 1958


46 posted on 01/30/2005 4:50:20 PM PST by snarks_when_bored
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 23 | View Replies ]

To: Canticle_of_Deborah
As a Catholic,I was always taught that the first sin was disobedience. The first and principal example took place in the supernatural realm and was Lucifer's "non servium"

The second,took place in the Garden of Eden where again we find disobedience the first sin,this time in the natural world. Adam and Eve chose to disobey God. God told them not to eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil; they disobeyed. Now we come into the world tarnished with that Original Sin. Disobedience,don't you think?

Could you cite the source of the information you offered about obedience being a part of justice. I've never heard that before and to be quite honest,it makes no sense to me,so I would like to read it in context. Thanks.

53 posted on 01/30/2005 5:54:04 PM PST by saradippity
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 23 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson