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To: annalex
At this point the topic is, did Luther understand the passages I pointed out in the written Gospels? I showed you that he most likely ignored them, and fifty posts down no one can explain how he could possibly interpret them and still stick to his theories about works. Sure, you and others explained what Protestants think about the relationship between faith, grace, and work, and you posted plenty of scripture that I have no quarrel with, but there was not a single comment addressing specifically the gospel passages I listed in #20 from the Protestant perspective. This is why at this point I would perfer not to change the topic to other subjects that you brought up.

You cite ONE passage and put all your works in that basket. No one does not see that the FRUIT of their salvation is important or that God will not reward the diligent working out of His ordained plans.

Simply scripture is clear that salvation MUST precede your works or it is of no eternal benefit. You say you must work to grow your faith> But God says what is NOT OF FAITH is sin.,

So YOU, not Luther, have an huge eternal problem

This is what you can expect

Jesus never taught salvation by works, in fact he taught just the opposite

Mat 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them

. Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

What is the will of the Father?
Scripture says this is His will for men

Jhn 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

The will of the Father is that we believe, so what does Jesus say to the man that thought his works would earn him salvation ?

Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. That mans WORKS which he did in the name of Jesus were called SIN (iniquity) by Christ. Why?He did them IN THE NAME OF CHRIST , WHY WERE THEY SIN?

Rom 14:23 And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because [he eateth] not of faith: for whatsoever [is] not of faith is sin.

Romans 8:8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

He that is not with me is against me : and he that gathereth not with me scattereth .  Luke 11:23

"So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God .

But we are all as an unclean [thing], and all our righteousnesses [are] as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.  Isaiah 64:6 

The sacrifice of the wicked [is] an abomination to the LORD but the prayer of the upright [is] his delight.  Proverbs 15:8

How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God , purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God ?  Hebrew 9:14

If you are counting on works of your righteousness to increase your faith, you look in the wrong place because the unsaved can never please God. YOUR FAITH IS IN YOUR WORKS, THAT IS THE ONLY FAITH YOU BUILD, FAITH IN YOURSELF . That will never save you .

101 posted on 12/13/2005 7:37:55 PM PST by RnMomof7 ("Sola Scriptura,Sola Christus,Sola Gratia,Sola Fide,Soli Deo Gloria)
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To: RnMomof7

So can anyone explain the passages I mentioned in 20? That means going by the gospel texts in question, not posting a loosely fitting collection of quotes from other contexts.

One substantive thing you say in your post is misunderstood by you. We all agree that faith precedes all good work, that good work is a fruit of faith and that we will be judged by the fruits of our faith, which is work. So Matthew 7:20 and 7:21 is exactly waht I am saying. Do you suppose Luther has read those?

Will one who professed faith and subsequent to that violated the commandments of Christ go to heaven?


102 posted on 12/13/2005 9:17:30 PM PST by annalex
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