Posted on 01/17/2006 3:55:48 PM PST by annalex
Thank you for your valuable opinion.
The single most inexplicable and corruptive tenet of Catholicism through the ages.
Indulgences: a stumbling block for the Protestants and a foolishness for the Orthodox ;>
A Scriptural "stumbling block," as is "Purgatory."
Over the ages the CC has amassed an untold fortune convincing untold millions -- rich and poor -- that monetary "Indulgences" would influence and limit time spent (in leiu of penance) in "Purgatory."
Simony has always been a sin recognized by the Church, most people, including clerics, have no problem sinning. Nothing anti scriptural about either indulgences or purgatory. Sola scriptura and sola fide, well those are horses of a different color.
Thank you. I did not post it to quarrel with the Protestants, and did not ping any. This is an in-depth article regarding the exact nature of penance following absolution of sin. It is intended for those who understand and agree with the fundamental teaching of the Church, but want to learn more. Typically, those would be my fellow Catholic and Orthodox.
Any scriptural citation to make your case?
Unfortunately, it's a practice that had been engaged in for centuries by the CC. Just how do you think they amassed this priceless fortune? The real estate alone is worth hundreds of billions.
"Indulgences do not limit time spent in Purgatory. Purgatory is not temporal (you have to be dead to get there), therefore, there is no "time" in Purgatory.
"These claims are commonly part of the mythologies created by folks that don't know no better."
"Myths"?? I beg to differ as a former Catholic.
Purgatory? Now we're talking myth. But even so, in the not too distant past monetary Indulgences certainly were encouraged in leiu of less "suffering."
Oddly, there seems not to be ANY authority who has ever definitively explained the place, process and terms of entry OR exit.
If you can shed some light on the matter, I'd appreciate it....Btw, I'm not an F16 pilot.
"Just how do you think they amassed this priceless fortune? The real estate alone is worth hundreds of billions."
As the font of Western civilization, the treasures of the Catholic Church are priceless. These treasures are works of faith, love and devotion over 2000 years. Certainly, none would be so crass as to imply that Michaelangelo created his Pieta because he wanted to lessen time in purgatory or spring souls or some such nonsense. Certainly not.
The mythologies concerning indulgences/purgatory are commonly repeated in many circles. Their repetition certainly does not make them true.
The Catholic Church has never, ever taught that indulgences lessened time in purgatory.
This is a common myth that is in part due to the way that indulgences were categorized, in the past. Old prayer cards (and such) used to be categorized using the monastic days of penance. Folks that didn't know no better assumed that the days referred to on the back of grannies prayer card referred to the days that one would be spared of fiery sufferin' in purgy-tory if one said the pious prayer. We all know what happens when one assumes.
In my experience, former Catholics are notoriously unreliable as a source of authentic teachings of the Catholic Church.
I'll try to shed some light on Purge-a-tory in plain Evanenglish.
Purgatory is the place where the saints go to be perfectly conformed to Christ. It is a place where the grace of God strips away any last remants of selfishness so that the saints of God may blaze with the glory of God with the heavenly host. Purgatory isn't necessary. Some Christians leave this earth without any trace of selfishness and go immediately to the throne. God makes provision for the rest, out of love, to complete their perfection begun on earth and not finished. That provision is called Purgatory.
Let's all hug and hold hands. I feel a song coming on.
I'll try to shed some light on Purge-a-tory in plain Evanenglish.
Purgatory is the place where the saints go to be perfectly conformed to Christ. It is a place where the grace of God strips away any last remants of selfishness so that the saints of God may blaze with the glory of God with the heavenly host. Purgatory isn't necessary. Some Christians leave this earth without any trace of selfishness and go immediately to the throne. God makes provision for the rest, out of love, to complete their perfection begun on earth and not finished. That provision is called Purgatory.
Let's all hug and hold hands. I feel a song coming on."
Thanks for 'splainin' Purgatory "in plain Evanenglish."
Now if you could only share in Cathenglish the secret "authentic" source of such a revelation.
(Are we singing 'Kumbaya' yet??)
Sure, but 'anti' doesn't mean 'extra', it means opposed too.
"Now if you could only share in Cathenglish the secret "authentic" source of such a revelation."
Catechism of the Catholic Church. Authentic teaching. Plain English. Fully indexed and Scripturified.
"To remove sin and its after-effects requires several things."
Hebrews 9:22
In fact, the law requires that nearly everything be cleansed with blood, and without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness.
How were sins forgiven in the OT?
By blood alone.
"The souls who are now in purgatory are those “who died in the charity of God, were truly repentant, but who had not made satisfaction with adequate penance for their sins and omissions.”
Why are you trying to pay for somethiong that is freely offered???
Colossians 2:13
And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
Romans 3:24
Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
As to "Indulgences," I'll briefly and simply comment on "Principle 1: Sin Results in Guilt and Punishment."
We are ALL "sinners." The "guilt and punishment" has been paid by the blood and stripes of Christ. That simple.
On the issue of "Indulgences," the one I address is one of monetary in nature.
Instead of "penance," money or deed was a substitute, and it could be applied to another's "account."
I believe this practice began sometime in the Middle Ages, but I won't belabor this historical point by providing link after link.
"Plain English" I'll give ya ;-)
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