How Not To Defend Liturgical Reform--Exhibit A (response to Fr. Larson's attack of EWTN Mass)

DH Price ^ | August 4, 2006 | Dale Price

[NYer]

A keeper!

[redhead]

Apparently, Father is too well-versed to have ever actually READ the Vatican II prescriptions for the celebration of the Holy Eucharist, or he would have learned that what he saw on EWTN is the Mass EXACTLY as it has been called for in those documents.

Poor Father...nobody told him in seminary that the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass is NOT a hootenanny. I'll bet his parishoners think he's just the cutest thing every Sunday, too.

Ignatius Press publishes a free booklet of the liturgy called "The Mass of Vatican II." It is free for the asking, and has no royalty restrictions, so it can be freely reproduced. We used it for the celebration of our Latin Mass in Minnesota.

[siunevada]

The question of mixing Latin and English came up one time on EWTN if I remember correctly.

The stated reason was that the Mass is broadcast to the whole world. At least we can all share the common prayers if they are said in Latin.

Father probably assumes EWTN is just an American network.

[siunevada]

Fine--I buy that way too many of the masses in the 50s were slapdash mumblefests, that the music was treacle (plus ca change) and that too few understood what was going on.

I beg to disagree. I'm sure it happened but in my experience in several different parishes 1950's that was not the way Mass was celebrated.

Although, one thing was very different as a schoolchild. If you weren't paying attention you might attract the unwanted attention of your teacher.

A lot of the adults in my parish could use a 'minder' to keep them on track during the Mass these days. "Full participation" seems to include a lot of yackety-yack.

[NYer]

Although, one thing was very different as a schoolchild. If you weren't paying attention you might attract the unwanted attention of your teacher.

All it took was one of those rock solid stares!

Remember the clickers?

The summer before 4th grade, we moved to Queens and I was enrolled in Our Lady of the Cenacle School in Richmond Hill. The first day of school, I was quite nervous, not knowing anyone else. The kids milled around the schoolyard, sharing stories from their summer vacation. Suddenly ... and I mean quite suddenly .... bells rang, while the sound of a needle in the groove of a record resounded throughout the schoolyard. The strains of John Phillip Sousa resounded from well placed loudspeakers and the children immediately formed single lines. Several nuns escorted us into the school, clapping their hands in beat to the accompanying melody.

It was, of course, the only way they could maintain control. There were 3 classes of 50+ students for each grade. There was NO departmentalization. You and sister were stuck with each other, for better or worse, throughout the entire school year, confined to the same classroom, day after day. Oh the memories!

[NYer]

Good to see you in the forum :-) Has the new pastor arrived?

[Fast Ed97]

Fr. Jan Larson

Somehow I knew he would be over 45 years old.

[netmilsmom]

>>A keeper!<<

I do sooooooo agree!

[redhead]

He has been Fr. Wes's assistant for several years. I guess he is just getting promoted. We all know and like him, so it shouldn't be too hard. I don't have a problem with the changeover, but I know there are older parishoners who have developed quite an attachment for Fr. Wes, and it is going to be hard on them to have to say goodbye to him and transfer that loyalty to Fr. Mike. Fr. Mike is a lovely person, but his method of celebration is, of course, different from that of Fr. Wes. I think that is more the problem than just about anything else.

[GinaLolaB]

When i first read what this priest said, I wondered why he is commenting about the EWTN Mass now. It has been this way for about 20 years that I know of.

[NYer]

Fr. Mike is a lovely person, but his method of celebration is, of course, different from that of Fr. Wes. I think that is more the problem than just about anything else.

Here's a golden opportunity for you as a Roman Catholic to reach out and help them through this transition. Losing a fatherly figure is difficult but achievable, especially when the liturgy remains intact. You and I know only too well what it is like to have a new pastor with a 'fresh' approach to how the Mass will be celebrated; and we're not talking in conformity with the norms laid down by the GIRM.

[NYer]

Good point! One can only conjecture.

[steve8714]

I belonged to a parish wherein the priest would start the Mass by bringing out a bag with a toy for the few children at the Mass, designed in his mind to share some great holy truth with them. He asked me once why I never participated in the sign of peace, I don't think he liked my answer.
The Sunday after 9/11, when he started ranting about the "evil men who control Alan Greenspan" I got up in the middle of his "sermon" and left. Anyone who says the liturgical reforms weren't coupled with a political and social agenda is nuts, in my view.

[franky]

It reminds me of a priest who supported the Berrigan brothers and "The Trial of the Catonsville Nine".

I could not believe at the time that a priest would get in the pulpit and support these priest's bombings.

[baa39]

...and have a beard.

[TradicalRC]

no Sign of Peace, and, of course, no Communion from the cup for the lay people who are present.

OK, I can see the gripe on these. So long as the former isn't a tooth-grinding enforced Hugfest, I've never understood the grousing.

Actually, I fully realize that this is a hearkening back to 42 A.D. or whatever but it REALLY strikes me as a complete disruption of the flow of the Mass. I have absolutely Never seen this done in any way that it is done well.

[dangus]

Feel better, Mr. Price.

(Not that I didn't enjoy a nice snarky post, NYer :^D )

[dangus]

Let's just say that the Royal Order of the Bruces might not like him.

[rogator]

"Apparently, Father is too well-versed to have ever actually READ the Vatican II prescriptions for the celebration of the Holy Eucharist, or he would have learned that what he saw on EWTN is the Mass EXACTLY as it has been called for in those documents."

He is old enough to know better and he has read them.
Just like the Code of Canon Suggestions, liturgical law is a pick and choose operation.
Expert liturgists like Larson have insight as to the authentic "mind" of the Church. They know which of the documents are essential and which are "outmoded" or "archaic".
Heck, most of these guys (and gals) even have college degrees in liturgy (whatever that means) from prestigious Catholic institutions of higher learning such as Seattle University.