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Three Reasons the Church’s Enemies Hate The Immaculate Conception
TFP ^ | 12.08.06 | Plinio Corrêa de Oliveira

Posted on 12/12/2006 10:51:32 PM PST by Coleus

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To: kawaii

That is not an example of Jesus commanding anyone to baptize people with the Holy Spirit.


741 posted on 12/18/2006 8:29:21 AM PST by DungeonMaster (Acts 17:11 also known as sola scriptura.)
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To: DungeonMaster

Surrrreeee it isn't...


742 posted on 12/18/2006 8:31:35 AM PST by kawaii
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To: Frank Sheed
Thank you, my Brother! It is marvelous to know that WE have a liturgy, based on Sacred Scripture, handed down and commanded of us to maintain and celebrate by Jesus the Christ every Sabbath and that it has not changed in substance for over 2,000 years! That is a great gift from God!

Let's see.

1. God confirmed to the Children of Israel which day the Sabbath was by withholding manna on that day. (they've not lost track of the day since)

2. People in pointy hats changed that day to Sunday.

I think I'll go with number one. :-)

743 posted on 12/18/2006 8:34:12 AM PST by Invincibly Ignorant
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To: kawaii

Like I said, you wish.


744 posted on 12/18/2006 8:37:35 AM PST by DungeonMaster (Acts 17:11 also known as sola scriptura.)
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To: DungeonMaster

I don't need to wish, thousands of Greek theologians who actually knew how to read Koine Greek have studied it in my church for 2000 years.

I don't need to use my arrogant 'sole right to interpret 3rd generation copies of scripture' card, because unlike protestants I have the word of the folks who were there from the start. The ones who spoke Greek, the ones who distributed Holy Scripture, the ones from the 5 ancient Sees the apostles themselves founded.

The only one with wishful thinking here is yourself.

You can wish you could understand the gospels in Koine Greek.

You can wish your 15th century or latter church of men had some link with the apostles.

But you can never interpret scripture to anything near the accuracy of the church fathers because you are in fact a person born far from where the church started, far after when it started, with a Bible translation far removed from the language in which the events of Scripture occured and were written in, and even if you were capable of compensating for all these alone St Paul was clearly against the idea of any one man interpreting scripture for himself.


745 posted on 12/18/2006 8:55:09 AM PST by kawaii
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To: Invincibly Ignorant

And may the Peace of Christ by upon you too!


746 posted on 12/18/2006 9:02:12 AM PST by Frank Sheed ("It is terrible to contemplate how few politicians are hanged." --G.K. Chesterton)
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And may the Peace of Christ by be upon you too!

Sorry...need some caffeine!
747 posted on 12/18/2006 9:05:14 AM PST by Frank Sheed ("It is terrible to contemplate how few politicians are hanged." --G.K. Chesterton)
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To: Frank Sheed
And may the Peace of Christ by upon you too!

And with your spirit. :-)

748 posted on 12/18/2006 9:37:58 AM PST by Invincibly Ignorant
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To: DungeonMaster

Jesus says we must be baptized. Are you arguing with Him?

Matthew 28:18-20
And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth. Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.


749 posted on 12/18/2006 12:09:55 PM PST by nanetteclaret (Our Lady's Hat Society)
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To: kawaii
As for Saint Paul he doesn't explicitly mention water (mind you he mentions that he Baptised few anyway) but he does use the word baptism which comes from the Greek Baptizo which refers to submersion.

Every source I've seen says 'Immersion', not Submersion...The difference is being into as opposed to under...We are baptized 'into' Christ...

"He was born and baptized, that by His passion He might purify the water." (The Epistle of Ignatius to the Ephesians, Chapter 18, Roberts-Donaldson)

Rev 21:14 And the wall of the city had twelve foundations: And in them, the twelve names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb,

From Matthew to Revelation, I never once saw the name of Ignatius...He must be the 13th apostle not mentioned in the bible...Joe Smith and Mohammed wrote epistles as well...There's two more apostles...Who else you got on your list??? Maybe Ted Kennedy will write an epistle...

750 posted on 12/18/2006 5:22:25 PM PST by Iscool (Anybody tired??? I have a friend who says "Come unto me, and I'll give you rest"...)
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To: xzins; kosta50; Kolokotronis
Therefore, it is more precise to say that Mary is the "mother of Jesus, the Incarnate 2d Person of the Godhead."

Is there anything theologically wrong with what is between those quotation marks?

I don't have any problem with it. It's funny, just a few minutes ago I hesitated using the word "Theotokos" to Kosta because I wasn't sure if there was an implication I could not agree with, so this was timely. I read a little about the Third Ecumenical Council, and from that it is easy for me to agree with Theotokos as opposed to Christotokos. Nestorius was a crock. I don't know if that is enough to give me a license to use the word, though. :)

From what I read, I think what you said would have passed muster with the Council.

751 posted on 12/19/2006 3:09:16 AM PST by Forest Keeper
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To: Forest Keeper; Kolokotronis; kosta50; P-Marlowe; blue-duncan; Blogger; Dr. Eckleburg; sitetest
mother of Jesus, the Incarnate 2d Person of the Godhead

The above is better theology than "Mother of God" because it is specific. It accurately portrays Jesus as both fully human and fully God.

The "Mother of God" does not accurately portray the human side of the Christ. Also, in a Trinitarian system in which the word "God" is ambiguous, it gives the impression that Mary preceded the entire Trinity.

I do think that "God bearer" is slightly better than "Mother of God," but "Jesus, the incarnate 2d Person of the Godhead" is better than either.

752 posted on 12/19/2006 5:26:57 AM PST by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and proud of it! Supporting our troops means praying for them to WIN!)
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To: Iscool

there are several apostles who were not among the 12. in fact Christ appeared to more than 70 apostles after the resurection or did you think st paul was following Christ around from day one?!?

further without folks like st ignateus you wouldn't even have the collected scripture let alone the translations you love to misquot and misinterpret


753 posted on 12/19/2006 6:51:34 AM PST by kawaii
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To: Iscool

there are several apostles who were not among the 12. in fact Christ appeared to more than 70 apostles after the resurection or did you think st paul was following Christ around from day one?!?

further without folks like st ignateus you wouldn't even have the collected scripture let alone the translations you love to misquot and misinterpret


754 posted on 12/19/2006 6:51:48 AM PST by kawaii
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To: kawaii
there are several apostles who were not among the 12. in fact Christ appeared to more than 70 apostles after the resurection or did you think st paul was following Christ around from day one?!?

A disciple does not an apostle make...

Let's try this again...This time from your own corrupt Catholic bible:

Rev 21:14 And the wall of the city had twelve foundations: And in them, the twelve names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb,

Your very own Catholic bible says there are 12 apostles...Neener, neener...

further without folks like st ignateus you wouldn't even have the collected scripture let alone the translations you love to misquot and misinterpret

The manuscripts that were used to write my bible came out of Syria, where Christians Originated...Not Africa, where your bible came from...Ignatius is connected with your bible...Not mine...

755 posted on 12/19/2006 8:23:34 AM PST by Iscool (Anybody tired??? I have a friend who says "Come unto me, and I'll give you rest"...)
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To: Iscool
Jesus then spent 3 years with the Apostle Paul

That certainly explains alot. /so

756 posted on 12/19/2006 9:21:26 AM PST by Jaded ("I have a mustard- seed; and I am not afraid to use it."- Joseph Ratzinger)
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To: Iscool

Whatever bible you claim to have one thing is certain; Syrian Christians (be them Orthodox Christians, Eastern Catholics, or Non Chaceldonians which constitute Christianity there) would reject your silly protestant innovations.


757 posted on 12/19/2006 9:57:20 AM PST by kawaii
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To: kawaii
Whatever bible you claim to have one thing is certain; Syrian Christians (be them Orthodox Christians, Eastern Catholics, or Non Chaceldonians which constitute Christianity there) would reject your silly protestant innovations.

Well now, they certainly wouldn't be the first 'christian' group(s) to reject the word of God, would they???

The bible says there were 12 apostles...You want it to be 70...So we'll throw the bible in the trash and keep the 70...Silly protestant innovations???

Sorry Charlie, that's a Catholic and bible innovation as well...

758 posted on 12/19/2006 3:36:31 PM PST by Iscool (Anybody tired??? I have a friend who says "Come unto me, and I'll give you rest"...)
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To: Jaded
That certainly explains alot

What, your church didn't tell you that???

If you don't know that Paul spent 3 years with Jesus after He was ressurected and received his instructions directly from God and NOT the other apostles, why are you even commenting on this topic???

Go down to the dime store and buy a bible...And then, read it...Find out if your church is telling you the truth...

759 posted on 12/19/2006 3:50:29 PM PST by Iscool (Anybody tired??? I have a friend who says "Come unto me, and I'll give you rest"...)
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To: Iscool

Really.

So St Paul isn't an Apostle.

Yeah whatever.


760 posted on 12/19/2006 7:46:33 PM PST by kawaii
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