Posted on 06/28/2007 7:33:54 PM PDT by tnarg
The number of priests is declining. The Pope however cautions his congregations not to put in place of priests the laity for that could lead to an over reliance on laypersons and finally fade out the priestly presence.
However, parish after parish is discovering that it is forced to call upon laypersons to act on behalf of the church. The reason? There simply is no priest within miles.
In some cases, nuns are doing much of the priestly spiritual work. When nuns are not there, to whom can the congregations turn to but their own — laypersons?
In other words, the Vatican still proclaims the historic Catholic ideal — a church led by ordained priests. The reality however spells out another paragraph in local church life, that is, laypersons are left without ordained priests; but they are not left without their own lay commitments to the church.
“The number of permanent deacons has increased from 11,371 in 1995 to 15,027 in 2005. The United States has more deacons now than the rest of the world combined.
“A lay person, with the bishop’s approval, can conduct prayer services and distribute the Eucharist that a priest has previously consecrated, while deacons have the further ability to preach homilies.
“Canon law gives preference to the deacon as parish leader and, ‘Some bishops use deacons as the first line of replacement’ in priestless parishes. ‘And the fact that they are ordained has ecclesiastical significance.’
“Deacon John Bresnahan of Lynn, Mass., said, ‘What needles deacons in some dioceses is there’s a push to use lay administrators’ rather than tap the diaconate.
“‘One of the biggest arguments you hear for ordaining women is the shortage of priests,’ he said. ‘Well, the number of deacons is up. Let’s look at this positively and use them,’” per Gail Besse via National Catholic Register at http://www.catholic.org/national/national_story.php?id=20205
Feminists are itching to take over Catholic pulpits. The Vatican resists their moves at every turn. Therefore, the reasonable turn is to ordain deacons to see through the work of the priests, that is, utilizing the commitment of ordained deacons as fully recognized priests.
It could very well be that future reality of priests diminishing to practically a zero level will force the hand of ordained deacons acting out all the duties of the ordained priests. Why not?
According to Stephen Bates of the Guardian: “Father Radcliffe, now a monk in Oxford but tipped by some as a leader of the Catholic Church in England, said: ‘It is clearly the case that in many parts of the world celibacy has actually largely broken down — in many countries in Latin America, parts of Africa, to some extent in the United States.
"If it turns out to be the case that it is being largely ignored or bypassed, then a very negative witness is being given; and so we have to ask is it possible now — either we have to provide celibate priests with considerably more support or we have to explore the possibility of them being married."
In addition, I have another suggestion. It is that ordained deacons be permitted to become the married priests.
"I’d bet a nickel to a donut that you’re a priest-wanna-be," I offered the newly ordained Catholic deacon.
We were seated in his dining room. His wife sat alongside him, smiling knowingly.
It did not take long for this Maine Lakes Region college professor to respond. "I guess you're 'right on'," he laughed heartily. With that, he showed me his ordination photos — prayers by clergy, congratulations from friends, priests greeting family. John surely was one proud fellow.
When I came upon Ken, another ordained deacon, both he and his wife were exceptionally pleased that in his retirement years he could serve his church as a deacon.
Since then, John has become Catholic chaplain at Maine Youth Center. Ken has become executive of the Knights of Columbus in another state. Both are beaming with fulfillment.
So there you have it, I thought. They are ordained to ministry. They are married.
A Lakes Region practicing Catholic shared with me: "With what's going on in my church, I wonder what's going to be the end result."
I posited that with the statistics of priests taking a downturn, it just could be a practical move to see those ordained as deacons becoming full-fledged priests. "Seems like history is taking a stand on this issue," I suggested.
The next time I attended Mass, I read Father Richard P. McBrien’s candid column, "Gays in the Priesthood." It was published in Maine's Catholic weekly, "Church World" (April 4, 2002, page 16).
This popular Catholic university professor stated forthrightly: "In recent weeks (there has been) increased expressions of antipathy toward gay priests, of whom there are surely thousands in the United States alone. Even though prominent psychiatrists and psychologists have been reminding us on television . . .that there is no necessary link between homosexuality and pedophilia, the popular view to the contrary still holds sway in many parts of the Church and in society at large. In such precincts the solution is easy: Get rid of gay priests and we’ll finally be rid of this horrible problem of sexual abuse of children.
"Surprisingly the starkest expression of this view emanates from one of the highest sources in all central administration of the Catholic Church: Dr. Joaquin Navarro-Valls, the pope’s official liaison with the media and psychiatrist by training. The Vatican spokesman has questioned whether homosexuals can validly be ordained, comparing the situation of a gay priest who may not realize that he is gay to that of a gay man who marries a woman while also unaware of his sexual orientation.
"Dr. Navarro-Valls pointed out that just as such a marriage can be annulled on the grounds that it was invalid from the start, so, too, the ordination of a gay man might similarly be declared invalid. A few priests have privately observed that, if this were actually to happen, the Roman Catholic Church might lose two-thirds of its priests under the age of 45 and some bishops as well. At the same time, many of its seminaries could be emptied of all but a handful of students."
Well, I mused, all the more it sounds reasonable to celebrate ordained deacons as full-fledged priests, thus alleviating the dwindling priest supply while at the same time putting into full-time ministry dedicated married servants of the church.
It would also open up the priesthood to more consecrated heterosexuals who presently shy away from the calling due to scandal attached to the priesthood.
Copyright © 2006 by J. Grant Swank, Jr. http://www.truthinconviction.us/weblog.php
Please don’t lump the eems in with Deacons and especially Nuns. Deacons go to years of training in seminary before being ordained and Nuns have made a lifetime comittment to the church.
Hello,
Married Men can be Ordained Deacons, but they shy away from Ordaining married men in the Latin Rite. Among the obvious practical reasons: such as increased Salaries, 24 hr availability and the like there are several Theological Reasons, such as the ancient Jewish Purity requirements.
While I don’t know if it is still enforced, (one of the myriad of reasons) Celibacy developed in the Latin Rite because Clergy were required to abstain from relations for a period of time prior to confecting the Eucharist (kind of like the old pre-V2 midnight Fast) and as the custom of daily Liturgy Developed it became basically impossible (or I would hope undesirable) for a married man to maintain this abstinence.
I fully support a Celibate presbyterate but there are many “Chancery jobs” that married Priests could fill, especially since they need not say their own personal Mass daily.
This is overall a good discussion to have, but the Permanent Deacon argument doesn’t hold water, as it is a seperate and distinct Vocation.
Most of the nuns involved in running parishes want to be priests, and so, alas, do most of the deacons (or at least they want to get up and preach). It’s true that most of the EEMs don’t.
My point, however, was that bishops of no-vocation dioceses have that situation because they think that the priest is actually no different from the deacon or the sister, not to mention the EEM, and this is the message they give to the priests by “replacing” them with nuns and deacons (and EEMs).
146. There can be no substitute whatsoever for the ministerial Priesthood. For if a Priest is lacking in the community, then the community lacks the exercise and sacramental function of Christ the Head and Shepherd, which belongs to the essence of its very life. For the only minister who can confect the sacrament of the Eucharist in persona Christi is a validly ordained Priest.
151. Only out of true necessity is there to be recourse to the assistance of extraordinary ministers in the celebration of the Liturgy. Such recourse is not intended for the sake of a fuller participation of the laity but rather, by its very nature, is supplementary and provisional. Furthermore, when recourse is had out of necessity to the functions of extraordinary ministers, special urgent prayers of intercession should be multiplied that the Lord may soon send a Priest for the service of the community and raise up an abundance of vocations to sacred Orders.
154. As has already been recalled, “the only minister who can confect the Sacrament of the Eucharist in persona Christi is a validly ordained Priest”. Hence the name “minister of the Eucharist” belongs properly to the Priest alone. Moreover, also by reason of their sacred Ordination, the ordinary ministers of Holy Communion are the Bishop, the Priest and the Deacon, to whom it belongs therefore to administer Holy Communion to the lay members of Christ’s faithful during the celebration of Mass. In this way their ministerial office in the Church is fully and accurately brought to light, and the sign value of the Sacrament is made complete.
156. This function is to be understood strictly according to the name by which it is known, that is to say, that of extraordinary minister of Holy Communion, and not “special minister of Holy Communion” nor “extraordinary minister of the Eucharist” nor “special minister of the Eucharist”, by which names the meaning of this function is unnecessarily and improperly broadened.
157. If there is usually present a sufficient number of sacred ministers for the distribution of Holy Communion, extraordinary ministers of Holy Communion may not be appointed. Indeed, in such circumstances, those who may have already been appointed to this ministry should not exercise it. The practice of those Priests is reprobated who, even though present at the celebration, abstain from distributing Communion and hand this function over to laypersons.
158. Indeed, the extraordinary minister of Holy Communion may administer Communion only when the Priest and Deacon are lacking, when the Priest is prevented by weakness or advanced age or some other genuine reason, or when the number of faithful coming to Communion is so great that the very celebration of Mass would be unduly prolonged. This, however, is to be understood in such a way that a brief prolongation, considering the circumstances and culture of the place, is not at all a sufficient reason.
I like for Nuns to have opportunities because I want to young women to see it as an attractive option for themselves. But I have to agree with you about the wannabe priests — that’s the thinking we have to get away from. I’m reminded of what Paul said about we are one body with many members, and how can you say an arm is better than a leg, but what good does it do for a finger to suddenly decide it would rather be an eye?
and Jesus wasnt a shepherd, teacher, exhorter, consoler? and you refer to the catholic church as "man made?" How so? I think the protestand church is more man made with its sola scriptura(which I am still trying to find in the Bible).
Yes. It's purely intentional. The doctrine of Sola Scriptura, by the virtue of not being provable solely by Scripture, is contradictory.
As a side note, in my opinion it isn't quite that simple to brush off Sola Scriptura, even though I do reject it.
I dont see how I am invoking SS. Besides, Martin Luther came up with the idea of SS.
Sinkspur, is that you?
Martin Luther was a schizophrenic, paranoid drunk who couldn’t control his libido and told his folllowers to “sin boldly.” You gonna tout that as well?
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OK, hold up there a minute, I see no problem whatsoever with altar girls, if there can be female ministers of the word and female eucharistic ministers, then what on earth is wrong with altar girls?
I think the problem with altar girls is that when there are altar girls, then boys tend to not be so eager to serve as altar boys. In the past, some of those altar boys, grew up to be Priests. With the introduction of girls, I think it has diminished what in the past was a role in which boys could think about the Priesthood.
i read a while ago on FR about catholics in nigeria who WALK up to 8 hours one way to go to mass. If catholics can;t be bothered DRIVING a few km’s further than usual to go to mass then they deserve having nuns running their parish.
the biggest thing that discourages me from (and i am sure many other guys) from considering priesthood (as a Novus Ordo priest anyway) are ALTAR GIRLS!!!! Its a job for guys only. Its like going hunting, or playing NFL with a girl- it’s just something you DON’T do.
you see all those bad statistics about why people like ME aren’t answering the call, well i am telling you.
besides, its in canon law that girls can only serve if there are no guys available.
“The number of priests is declining?”
This is inaccurate.
“According to the ("Annuario Pontificio") yearbook newly compiled stats for the years between 2004 and 2005, the number of Catholics increasing in the world from 1,098 million to 1,115 million, a growth of 1.5 percent.”
2007 edition “Annuario Pontificio,”
http://www.speroforum.com/site/article.asp?id=7895&t=Number+of+world's+Catholic+priests+grows+slightly
And I know I will probably be flamed for this but I am against all these “Eucharistic ministers” distributing Holy Communion. If it takes an additional ten or fifteen minutes for the priest to distribute Holy Communion then so be it.
Flame on, I have my asbestos PJ’s on. LOL
Happy Saturday, ya’ll.
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