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To: dangus
1. You presume the devil’s words would always perfectly reflect the truth of what is in the devil’s heart?
2. Ever hear of a rhetorical question?

1. That doesn't explain his motive. If he already knew that Jesus was certainly the Messiah, what's his motive in tempting him? Surely, as the demons fled in Christ's presence because of His authority, Satan knew he couldn't possibly trick God.

2. But they weren't questions, they were commands. "If you are the Son of God, then DO this."

This is pure speculation on my part, but it also makes more sense with regard to the actual temptations. Satan, IMHO, was probing to see if Jesus were just another Jew or the Messiah, Himself. Satan appeals to three very powerful conditions of the Jews of that time:

1. Hunger - if stones could be turned to bread, all of Judea could be fed.
2. Detestation of the Pharisees and Saducees - Publicly casting Himself from the seat of Moses, only to be saved by the angels, would place Him above the hypocritical religious authorities and neutralize their corruption.
3. Hatred of the Roman occupation - Sharing power with Satan over all of Judea would mean the expulsion of the Romans and the establishment of whatever form of government the common Jews desired.


At the same time, if rejected, these temptations would confirm Satan's suspicions of Jesus:

The first temptation would prove if Jesus could perform supernatural miracles. The second temptation would prove if Jesus has authority over the angels. The third temptation would prove if Jesus desired earthly power like any other oppressed Jew of that time. If Satan knew for certain who Jesus was, these temptations would be moot.

Unfortunately for Satan, being up against Christ meant getting answers which turned his own logic against him, by citation of Scripture. When Jesus commanded it, Satan fled, and at that point, it's my opinion that Satan received his confirmation of Who Jesus is.

It's possible that both of our views are correct. It's possible Satan was tested at the beginning with the vision of the Madonna and child, and so knew that God would be incarnate through a Virgin, and was walking the earth at that time. It's also possible Satan didn't know for sure that Jesus was He, since, as the story goes, He was shown to the angels as an infant, not an adult.

In any case, it's a fascinating episode in the life of Christ. I appreciate the discussion.

19 posted on 08/28/2007 7:40:14 AM PDT by Rutles4Ever (Ubi Petrus, ibi ecclesia, et ubi ecclesia vita eterna)
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To: Rutles4Ever
Satan knew he couldn't possibly trick God.

Assuming for the moment, the Franciscan school's view of the fall of the angels because of outrage over the prospect of the incarnation, it would be consistent for the fallen angels to assume that the Incarnate God could indeed be tricked. (I think . . .)

Your own speculation is thought-provoking, especially tying them into the conditions of the Jews at the time. Is there any historical reason to suggest, though, that hunger would be any more pressing than at any other time? My own historical knowledge is spotty (I guess everyone's is -- just sometimes the spots are closer together!).

21 posted on 08/28/2007 9:35:21 AM PDT by maryz
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To: Rutles4Ever

I imagine Satan’s motive was simply to induce suffering on Jesus.

As for the rhetorical question: “If” is used in logical constructions. The only other option Satan would have would be to say, “SINCE you are the Son of God.” That would involve Satan confirming the divinity of Christ. I guess Satan was trying to suggest to Jesus that he was not really the Son of God: “If you were the Son of God, you would do such-and-such. If you refuse to do it, then you aren’t the Son of God.”

Yes, the temptation could not succeed, but the realization that he could not use his powers to alleviate his countrymen’s current suffering probably was a great suffering to Jesus.

Lastly, I wonder whether one can suggest what Jesus could learn without falling into the heresy of adoptionism. Did the human aspect of Jesus know when he was an infant that he would be crucified?


22 posted on 08/28/2007 11:34:21 AM PDT by dangus
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