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To: BipolarBob
We will all be given the keys to heaven if are His followers.

Bob, you are not following the Scriptural discourse that you insisted upon! The keys are symbolic. When you and I die and eventually reach Heaven (if that be the will of God), you will not be handed a set of keys. God will not place you or me in charge. Only Christ holds those keys! And He chose to "give" them to Peter when He made him "Prime Minister", get it? The keys are symbolic.

Peter was given no greater authority than the other disciples.

Indeed he was - as demonstrated in my previous post. Peter has the Keys of Authority over the Earthly Kingdom, the Church. For just a few minutes, take your head out of the NT and travel back to the OT. In 2 Sam. 7:16; Psalm 89:3-4; 1 and Chron.17:12,14, God promises to establish the Davidic kingdom forever on earth. Matt. 1:1 clearly establishes this tie of David to Jesus. Jesus is the new King of the new House of David, and the King will assign a chief steward to rule over the house while the King is in heaven. We read in Luke 1:32 that the archangel Gabriel announces to Mary that her Son would be given "the throne of His father David." Then, in Matt. 16:19, Jesus gives Peter the "keys of the kingdom of heaven."

A question for you, Bob. Why does the notion that our Lord established a head of the Church bother you so much?

128 posted on 11/17/2007 3:37:59 PM PST by NYer ("Where the bishop is present, there is the Catholic Church" - Ignatius of Antioch)
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To: NYer
A question for you, Bob. Why does the notion that our Lord established a head of the Church bother you so much?

It bothers me that Christ did not plainly state that there will be ONE person with infallible powers who will head His church. I see nothing that would require this and nothing that plainly states this. What I do see is that a willing and submissive heart is more important than doctrinal infallibility. Instead of practicing obeisance to a man, practice a following of Christs command to preach the gospel and love one another. The contrasts between your pope and the apostles is too great to make an equivalence.

129 posted on 11/17/2007 3:49:37 PM PST by BipolarBob (Yes I backed over the vampire, but I swear I didn't see it in my rear view mirror.)
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To: NYer
A question for you, Bob. Why does the notion that our Lord established a head of the Church bother you so much?

Jesus called the disciples to Him and they followed Him. Who has called the pope? Who appoints him?

If one were to put two persons of the "same" non-Catholic Christian denomination (i.e., two Presybterians, two Lutherans, two Baptists, etc.) in separate rooms with a Bible and a notepad and ask them to write down their "interpretation" of the Bible, passage for passage, shouldn't they then produce the exact same interpretation?

If the Catholic councils were infallible they would meet and vote for the new pope (by secret ballot) and the votes would be the exact same name the first time 100%. Done and over with in five minutes. With no pre-planning or discussion. Does this happen?

133 posted on 11/17/2007 4:47:37 PM PST by BipolarBob (Yes I backed over the vampire, but I swear I didn't see it in my rear view mirror.)
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