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To: PAR35
1) Yeah, I see what you're getting at. However, you have to admit, it *IS* difficult to discuss the differences between Catholicism and "Protestantism," since the latter consists of numerous groups with mutually exclusive beliefs. However, having a symbolic communion ritual is more prevalent than the views of Luther in the various Protestant denominations, is it not?

2) I think when he said "creation," he meant something along the lines of "creationism." I completely agree with your delineation between General and Special Revelation, and the logical progression from said revelation to Natural and Divine Law.

3) I think you mixed 3 up, since you had used it twice in your original post - your original '3' was regarding the objectiveness of the Eucharistic Sacrifice in Catholic theology, versus the WCF saying grace is imparted during the ritual depending on the internal constitution of the recipient. I'm not sure how your point here applies to that - if it does apply, could you dumb it down for this Cat-lick? ;-)

4) This confounds me, because in your number 3 above, you say "[then] we have the capability to respond." If we have the capability to respond, mustn't we exercise that capability?

14 posted on 07/15/2008 8:53:22 PM PDT by thefrankbaum (Ad maiorem Dei gloriam)
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To: thefrankbaum; PAR35
Author: Luther, by the way, taught the real presence

PAR35: Obviously ignorant of the Lutheran view

Obviously?

15 posted on 07/16/2008 12:01:29 AM PDT by annalex (http://www.catecheticsonline.com/CatenaAurea.php)
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To: thefrankbaum
I think you mixed 3 up

I went back and looked. You are correct. If we continue the discussion, I'll yield to your numbering system.

18 posted on 07/16/2008 5:18:24 PM PDT by PAR35
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To: thefrankbaum
1. However, having a symbolic communion ritual is more prevalent than the views of Luther in the various Protestant denominations, is it not?

First, we'd need to discount the mainline Protestants for whom the sacrament is pretty much meaningless other than as a comfortable habit.

The Baptists would be the largest of the symbolic crowd, and they've had a large influence on the large 'E' Evangleicals. On the other hand, there has been a lot of recent discussion as to how large the Southern Baptists really are - certainly far smaller than their claimed numbers.

The Lutherans and Reformed are discussed above - and there are a lot of Lutherans in the country.

So I'm not sure I'd concede the 'prevalent' at this point.

2. I don't see much left to debate there.

I have to post and run - I'll get back for the other 2 later.

19 posted on 07/16/2008 5:27:07 PM PDT by PAR35
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