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To: Iscool
There are angels on earth as well...There is nothing in the scriptures that suggest angels in heaven can hear us...

Psalm 103:
19 The LORD'S throne is established in heaven; God's royal power rules over all.
20 Bless the LORD, all you angels, mighty in strength and attentive, obedient to every command.
21 Bless the LORD, all you hosts, ministers who do God's will.
22 Bless the LORD, all creatures, everywhere in God's domain. Bless the LORD, my soul!

God's throne is established in Heaven. It is one part of His domain. The Psalmist is commanding creatures EVERYWHERE in His domain - not just the earthly realm.

Psalm 148:
1 Hallelujah! Praise the LORD from the heavens; give praise in the heights.
2 Praise him, all you angels; give praise, all you hosts.

Praise the LORD from the heavens, but the heavens cannot hear us? Interesting.

But what's funny is that some of the Catholics (on FR) deny praying to Mary while others (you) admit to praying to Mary and add justification...

Because the way many on this forum define "prayer" is a moving target. All Catholics would agree we "pray" to Saints, when "prayer" is understood to mean "ask." When some say, "No! Prayer is Worship!", then we (rightfully) admit that we do not "pray" to Saint, when "prayer" means "worship." When we bring in Latin terms clearly drawing the distinctions, we are accused of doublespeak. English is an awful language for theological discussion - German and Latin work much better.

I don't have a problem with you guys asking Mary or Heinrich Himmler (a Catholic) to pray for you...

The Nazi card? How insightful.

AS we all know, there is a large element in your religion who are pushing to make Mary the 4th part of the Trinity...I'd say you guys are just a step away from it...

Show me where any Catholic states Mary is equal to God - not what YOU think Catholics are saying. Again, English is a terrible language for theological discussion; the prefix co- is derived from the Latin, cum, meaning "with." Find any Latin dictionary for support.

There is no one in heaven who is more righteous than a born-again Christian on earth...

Ahh, pride. May God have mercy on me, a sinner. I did not post this response for you, since this has been discussed with you by countless people, but I hope some lurkers on these threads may understand the Church.

14 posted on 09/26/2008 9:34:30 AM PDT by thefrankbaum (Ad maiorem Dei gloriam)
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To: thefrankbaum
Ahh, pride. May God have mercy on me, a sinner. I did not post this response for you, since this has been discussed with you by countless people, but I hope some lurkers on these threads may understand the Church.

Has nothing to do with pride...It has to do with believing what God says...

All our (and your Saint's) righteousness are as filthy rags...The only righteousness that counts is the righteousness that God gave us...His righteousness...

19 posted on 09/26/2008 9:30:57 PM PDT by Iscool (If Obama becomes the President, it will be an Obama-nation)
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To: thefrankbaum

Bless the LORD, all creatures, everywhere in God’s domain. Bless the LORD, my soul! (Psalm 1-3:22)

Hmmmmm, it would seem from this verse, you could develop a theology to ask ants and amoeba and grizzly bears to “pray for us” since—if we take this with wooden literalism—then they must hear us....

Psalms are in the genre of poetry, and hence rightly use poetic license. Are they God’s holy Word, and true? Of course, but as they are....poetry, which uses readily apparent symbolic language. Trees as we know them don’t literally applaud, nor do mountains and hills form choirs, either... (Isa. 55:12, also a poetic passage).

Neither can one find support in holy Scripture for the idea that Christians in the presence of God in Heaven, share in his uniquely divine all-knowing and all-hearing attributes.


44 posted on 10/20/2008 8:59:35 PM PDT by AnalogReigns
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