Moscow Patriarchate disagrees with Constantinople's special position in the Orthodox world

interfax-religion.com ^ | April 10, 2009

[Tailgunner Joe]

Moscow, 10 April, Interfax - Bishop Hilarion of Volokolamsk, head of the Moscow Patriarchate Department for External Church Relations expressed his disagreement with the Constantinople Patriarchate urge to govern all church communities in the Orthodox diaspora.

"One of the major challenges for inter-Orthodox relations I see the claims of Constantinople Patriarchate to a special role in the Orthodox Church," Bishop Hilarion said at Interfax press conference.

"The Orthodox Church is going to be enforced the model of the Catholic Church, which is the most centralized church power leaded by the one bishop of the Universal Church," the Bishop said.

He reminded that "there was no such a model in the Orthodox Church" and voiced his doubt "that we have the right to review our teaching of the Church."

According to Bishop Hilarion, the leading bishops of Constantinople Patriarchate urge to review the principle of the priority in the Orthodox world. This model envisages that the Constantinople Patriarchate "shall govern all churches in the so-called diaspora." Communities not included within the borders of historical national churches shall assume the jurisdiction of Constantinople.

Bishop Hilarion said that this whole complex issues shall be discussed at the inter-Orthodox meeting, where the Constantinople model shall be imposed on the Russian Church.

[apro]

"What utter nonsense!! Constantinople (where Christianity first got official recognition) will FOREVER be a one of the three cities of Christianity along with Rome and Jerusalem. Simple, Period, Done!!

Moscow or no Moscow, nothing can be done to supplant Constantinople. Heck, people like me are hoping one day that the Byzantine Empire comes back (one of the greatest losses in history solely due to intra Christian infighting)"

So totally agree with this. Constantine XI legacy was used as a rallying cry for people from the Balkans such as the Greeks during their war for Independence from the Ottoman Empire and today numerous songs sing about the Emperor's return and the Empire's rise to glory again.

O The return of Constantine XI Marble King / Marble King
Herod Atticus theatre in Akropolis Athens

[babubabu]

“But the ultimate test is whether or not the rest of the Church agrees with the change”

actually, the ultimate test was whether the islamic Ottoman Sultan agreed with the change. It could be argued that the “ecumenical patriarch” was really an Ottoman puppet for hundreds of years.

[babubabu]

“But the ultimate test is whether or not the rest of the Church agrees with the change”

actually, the ultimate test was whether the islamic Ottoman Sultan agreed with the change. It could be argued that the “ecumenical patriarch” was really an Ottoman puppet for hundreds of years. Why would the Ottoman Sultan want to subject his christian people to a foreign a leader? Think about it.....

[babubabu]

I don’t mean any disrespect to the recent Patriarchs of Constantinople with my comments, but there are historical reasons why many Eastern Churches are not in union with Rome. Unfortunately, most have nothing to do with religion.

[babubabu]

I don’t mean any disrespect to the recent Patriarchs of Constantinople with my comments, but there are historical reasons why many Eastern Churches are not in union with Rome. Unfortunately, most have nothing to do with religion.

[babubabu]

I don’t mean any disrespect to the recent Patriarchs of Constantinople with my comments, but there are historical reasons why many Eastern Churches are not in union with Rome. Unfortunately, most have nothing to do with religion.

[FormerLib]

No, they have everything to do with rejecting Papal claims of supremacy over the other Apostles (directly contradicting Christ in Scripture).

[babubabu]

It does contradict “scripture”? okay I don’t know what document you get that from. Last time I read the bible peter had authority over the other disciples.

Anyway, the reason the orthodox church is not unified with the roman (western) church is because constantinople became istanbul. The ottoman sultans wanted an orthodox church without foreign influence. Thats why the first patriarch during ottoman rule retracted the council of Florence. (I know that many like to claim that it was never supported in the east, but, when it was signed, the majority of eastern bishops supported it).

[FormerLib]

It does contradict “scripture”? okay I don’t know what document you get that from.

Uh, I got it from this one, that says Holy Bible on the front.

Matthew 20:24-26 And when the ten heard it, they were greatly displeased with the two brothers. But Jesus called them to Himself and said, “You know that the rulers of the Gentiles lord it over them, and those who are great exercise authority over them. Yet it shall not be so among you; but whoever desires to become great among you, let him be your servant.

And it was the Orthodox laity that drove the rejection of the false union of Florence. Saint Mark of Ephesus rallied them to this effort.

[babubabu]

Nice picture. Sadly, these are more historically accurate......

[FormerLib]

So glad we got that scriptural reference cleared up.

You’re welcome.

[babubabu]

You can interpret scripture any way you like. Catholics can quote other text to support their position. Reasons why the churches deviated from each other (causing them to interpret scripture differently) are largely historical.

[babubabu]

You can interpret scripture any way you like. Catholics can quote other text to support their position. Reasons why the churches deviated from each other (causing them to interpret scripture differently) are largely historical.

[FormerLib]

And the reasons are also religious as well, correct?

[babubabu]

of course... especially if

1. Rome suddenly swore allegiance to a Holy Roman Emperor, rather than Byzantium.

2. Ottoman sultans had authority over christian leaders for hundreds of years

etc.

you can bet this effected religious dogma and any unification with other christians.....

[FormerLib]

you can bet this effected religious dogma and any unification with other christians.....

The religious dogma most affected was the Bishop of Rome deciding that he had authority to change the decision of an Ecumenical Council, also in contradiction to Scripture (Acts 15, if you need a reference).

[bobjam]

I thought Christ is head of the Orthodox Churches.

Really, don’t the patriarchs have more important things to concern themselves with?

[FormerLib]

http://www.impantokratoros.gr/PaulBallaster_Convolier.en.aspx

[babubabu]

I hope that you read the history of the Eastern and Western churches. Also read the bible and early ecumenical councils.

[FormerLib]

Isn’t it rather arrogant to assume that another Christian hasn’t read the Bible and requires the guidance of another to do so?