Posted on 04/22/2009 12:10:00 PM PDT by Colofornian
Hugh Hewitt, a political pundit radio personality, wants the Mormon presidential election runner Mitt Romney in the Whitehousevery badly. He casts his pre-election vote in writing A Mormon in the Whitehouse? (Regnery, 2007). In defense of Romney, Hewitt also defends Mormonism better than some Latter-day Saints (LDS). This is strange for a Presbyterian, as what Hewitt claims for himself. It is possible and logically consistent that Hewitt could defend Romney as a republican without defending Mormonism, but he chooses otherwise. The reason that I find this strange is that Joseph Smith, the founder of Mormonism, claimed that God appeared to him and told him that Hughs church, Presbyterianism, is not true. Gods official statement on Presbyterians is found in Mormon scripture. To remain faithful to the prophet Joseph Smith, Romney cannot believe other that what Joseph Smith wrote in his scripture, I have learned for myself that Presbyterianism is not true (Pearl of Great Price, Joseph SmithHistory 1:20).
Is Hewitt slipping in his faith? Or is he just plain ignorant that real Mormonism condemns his faith by name? This anti-Presbyterian sentiment (hence, anti-Hewitts chosen faith) is recorded where Joseph Smith had a vision of God the Father (as a male being) and Jesus Christ in the spring of 1820. Smith asked God which Protestant denomination was truethe Methodists, Presbyterians, or Baptists. Smiths vision, as found in LDS scripture, states that these three denominations alone were in Palmyra, New York (1:9). Smith then queried, Who of all these parties is right; or, are they all wrong together? (1:10). Clearly Joseph Smith wanted to know if Presbyterianism (Hugh Hewitts faith) was right or wrong. He was answered by a personal appearance of God the Father and Jesus Christ in New York, where Jesus directly told him, join none of them, for they were all wrong, and the Personage who addressed me said that all their creeds were an abomination in his sight; that those professors were all corrupt; that: they draw near to me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me, they teach for doctrines the commandments of men, having a form of godliness, but they deny the power thereof (1:19).
Hugh is in big trouble with Jesus! To be most like his friend Mitt Romney, he needs to repent of his wrong Presbyterianism (since Jesus said so!) and repent of his creeds (beliefs) that are so abominable to Jesus, and repent of his corrupt faith. Of the three denominations, Smith singled out the Presbyterians as specifically not true. Hewitt needs to get right with the Jesus found in Mormon scripture. Mormon scripture is clearly anti-Presbyterian. Yet in the strangest twist of Hughs logic, he labels anyone an anti-Mormon in his book who has the same opinion of Mormonism as what Joseph Smith did of Presbyterians, but nowhere in his book did he call Smith (or Romney) an anti-Presbyterian.
Here is an example of how Hewitt defended Mormonism from his May 4, 2007 radio program:
Caller Greg: The question I have is, I know very little about Mormonism, and my question falls into the cult or denomination thing. I think, was it Pastore, a columnist with Townhall, wrote an article a couple of weeks ago? Its about the sum total of what I know about it.
Hewitt: I would encourage you to read my book, which of course is not a surprise to you, its available at Amazon dot com. I reject the cult title. I believe cult has about it an element of coercion, which is simply not applicable to the Mormons and it is a sect.
Caller Greg: Do you think [Greg was obviously drowned out and cut off the air by Hewitt.]
Hewitt: I just dont believe that you should call . Cult carries with it this wheezing of an organ in the background and the idea of chains in the basement and the Branch Davidian and James Jones and I think it is inappropriate for conversation. And when I see Frank next, Im going to argue that point with him. Cause, I just dont think if if and I do know where it comes from Walter Martin wrote the Kingdom of the Cults, but Walter Martin blames that Hinduism is a cult, that Islam is a cult, I dont think that he calls the Catholic Church a cult, but his definition is expansive. In the modern vernacular it means sinister and the Mormons arent just simply not sinister. Hey, Greg, thanks.
There are problems with Hewitts definition of cult. Hewitt does not distinguish between the scholarly definitions of cult from different fields of study, namely psychological, sociological, and theological. He first defined cult psychologically, which under certain circumstances is correct. Some cults use coercion on their members. He failed to tell his audience that this is the psychological definition and that there are other equally legitimate definitions in other fields of study.
To separate Mormonism from his coercion cult definition, he then tries to separate Mormonism from coercion. Had Hugh watched the PBS special, The Mormons, that aired just three days earlier (April 30 and May 1), he would have seen how Mormonism uses coercion and psychological pressure on its members. I would suggest that he view The Mormons online The Mormons (http://www.pbs.org/mormons/view) and pay special attention to the section on the excommunication of the Mormon intellectuals, many of whom were Brigham Young University educated, but when they intellectually differed with their church, then they were humiliated through excommunication. Also pay attention to the section about the pressure within Mormonism for perfection that gives LDS women a higher than national average of suicide and anti-depressant drug usage.
I dont know how Hewitt missed these things, but a scant Internet research would have shown him a much different story:
Ken Ponder, Ph.D, MORMON WOMEN, PROZAC® and THERAPY, Mormon Women, Prozac and Therapy Julie Cart, "Study Finds Utah Leads Nation in Antidepressant Use," Los Angeles Times, 20 February 2002, A6.
Degn, L. Yeates, E. Greenwell, B. Fiddler, L. Mormon women and depression, Sunstone magazine
Hilton, Sterling C, et al. 2002. Suicide Rates and Religious Commitment in Young Adult Males in Utah. American Journal of Epidemiology. Vol. 155, No. 5: 413-19. Suicide Rates and Religious Commitment in Young Adult Males in Utah
Even a pro-Mormon BYU study admits that Mormon women use more anti-depressants and commit suidide more than the national average http://www.usatoday. com/news/health/2004-04-02-mormon-depression_x.htm [Link no longer active]
Contrary to what Hewitt said, coersion, in fact, applies to Mormonism at several levels, therefore it indeed fits within his first description of a cult.
Hewitts next foible was to create a self-styled definition that is not found anywhere, Cult carries with it this wheezing of an organ in the background and the idea of chains in the basement and the Branch Davidian and James Jones and I think it is inappropriate for conversation. From where did he get this? This is not what most people think when they hear the word cult. Hugh most likely means Jim Jones, with apologies to all of the James Jones existing elsewhere. There is no question that the Branch Davidians and Jim Jones (the Peoples Temple) were cults, but what made them so? Did they have organs or chains in basements? Neither one did, but perhaps Hugh was thinking of the famous organ at the Mormon Tabernacle in Salt Lake City.
It appears that what Hugh was attempting was, again, a psychological or sociological definition of cult. I would suggest more sound and scholarly definitions of a cult from qualified writers who list Mormonism as a cult like sociologist Ronald Enroth, Ph.D. (Evangelizing the Cults, 1990), theologians Alan Gomes, Ph.D. (Unmasking the Cults, 1998); Drs. Nichols, Mather, and Schmidt (Encyclopedic Dictionary of Cults, Sects, and World Religions, 2007); and a host of others, including some from Hewitts reformed Protestant background, like Dr. Jan K. Van Baalan (Chaos of the Cults, 1938; Gist of the Cults, 1944), Dr. Anthony Hoekema (Four Major Cults, 1963; Mormonism, 1973), Dr. Ravi Zacharias (Kingdom of the Cults, general editor, 2006), and Josh McDowell and Don Stewart (The Deceivers, 1992).
Hewitt stated, I do know where it comes from. This I doubt, after hearing his answer. The term cult was first used of Mormonism in 1898. Hewitt continued, Walter Martin wrote the Kingdom of the Cults, but Walter Martin blames that Hinduism is a cult, that Islam is a cult, I dont think that he calls the Catholic Church a cult, but his definition is expansive. Since I began working with Walter Martin in 1976 and I have continuously been on the staff of researchers and editors for his works since then, I think that I am better positioned than Hewitt to say what Walter Martin taught.
Hewitt is absolutely wrong. Martin did not state that Hinduism and Islam are cults. Hugh owes Christians an apology for his careless denigration of Martin and his works. Beginning in 1985, Martin included several chapters on world religions in his best-selling Kingdom of the Cults, but he always made clear distinctions between cults and world religions. What Hewitt claims to know is a fabrication.
Hewitts final statement, In the modern vernacular it means sinister and the Mormons arent just simply not sinister. This has a twofold problem. It does not define the word cults, but perhaps it describes what some cults do. I challenge Hewitt to find any scholarly work that uses sinister and cult interchangeably as mutually definitional terms. A good theological definition of a cult is a group of people basing their beliefs upon the worldview of an isolated leadership, which always denies the central doctrines of the Christianity as found in the Bible (Josh McDowell, The Deceivers, 1992, 15). Mormonism, as what McDowell includes in his book, fits that description with Smith isolating himself from apostate Christianity and creating a worldview in opposition to biblical Christianity that contains gods, goddesses, populated worlds, spirit children, and the progression of mankind toward godhood.
The second part of Hewitts statement, that Mormons are not sinister, is debatable. Mormons are quite often sinister, in spite of what Hewitt claims. We could talk about such sinister things as the Mountain Meadows massacre, or the numerous scandals through the ages, which is why the Wall Street Journal once stated that Utah is the securities fraud capital of the United States (WSJ, 2/25/1974 and Utah Holiday Magazine, October, 1990), but that aside, I think that Hugh contradicts himself here since he admits that the Mormon Olympic scandal, which was an international embarrassment to the Mormon Church, was straightened out by none other than his wonderful friend, Mitt Romney. How can he say on one hand that Mormons are not sinister and on the other hand state that Mormons were caught in a bribery scandal with the International Olympic Committee that Mitt Romney had to straighten out? Queer, isnt it? The Mormons even fit Hughs last definition of a cult with their sinister actions, which is why Romney had to rescue their reputation.
I did.
I left the Baptist Cult many years ago.
Thanks AMPU. Prayers are always appreciated.
7For many imposters (seducers, deceivers, and false leaders) have gone out into the world, men who will not acknowledge (confess, admit) the coming of Jesus Christ (the Messiah) in bodily form. Such a one is the imposter (the seducer, the deceiver, the false leader, the antagonist of Christ) and the antichrist.
8Look to yourselves (take care) that you may not lose (throw away or destroy) all that we and you have labored for, but that you may [persevere until you] win and receive back a perfect reward [in full].
9Anyone who runs on ahead [of God] and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ [who is not content with what He taught] does not have God; but he who continues to live in the doctrine (teaching) of Christ [does have God], he has both the Father and the Son.
10If anyone comes to you and does not bring this doctrine [is disloyal to what Jesus Christ taught], do not receive him [do not accept him, do not welcome or admit him] into [your] house or bid him Godspeed or give him any encouragement. 11For he who wishes him success [who encourages him, wishing him Godspeed] is a partaker in his evil doings.
II John 1:7-11 ~ Amplified Bible~
As much as I would like to wish "some" (maybe two or three) LDSers "God Bless you" this portion of God's Word speaks other wise!
Dear Elsie, what do you say? I hope I didn't hijack this thread! I have a precious friend that needs some info on Born again Mormons, and you seem to know a great deal about the extreme differences. Thank you and May God Bless you.
Don’t like Hewitt and am not surprised he would back Romney.
You are welcome and same to you.
you have freepmail!
One more to go - that Organization with so many man-made practices: the ones that NO Scripture describes.
10 If anyone comes to you and does not bring this doctrine [is disloyal to what Jesus Christ taught], do not receive him [do not accept him, do not welcome or admit him] into [your] house or bid him Godspeed or give him any encouragement.
11 For he who wishes him success [who encourages him, wishing him Godspeed] is a partaker in his evil doings.
II John 1:10-11 ~ Amplified Bible~
Dear Elsie, what do you say?
What I say is worthless; but what GOD says is PRICELESS!
KJV Matthew 13:24-30
24. Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is likened unto a man which sowed good seed in his field: 25. But while men slept, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went his way. 26. But when the blade was sprung up, and brought forth fruit, then appeared the tares also. 27. So the servants of the householder came and said unto him, Sir, didst not thou sow good seed in thy field? from whence then hath it tares? 28. He said unto them, An enemy hath done this. The servants said unto him, Wilt thou then that we go and gather them up? 29. But he said, Nay; lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them. 30. Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn. KJV Matthew 13:36-43
36. Then Jesus sent the multitude away, and went into the house: and his disciples came unto him, saying, Declare unto us the parable of the tares of the field. 37. He answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man; 38. The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one; 39. The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels. 40. As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world. 41. The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; 42. And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth. 43. Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear. |
NIV Matthew 13:24-30 24. Jesus told them another parable: "The kingdom of heaven is like a man who sowed good seed in his field. 25. But while everyone was sleeping, his enemy came and sowed weeds among the wheat, and went away. 26. When the wheat sprouted and formed heads, then the weeds also appeared. 27. "The owner's servants came to him and said, `Sir, didn't you sow good seed in your field? Where then did the weeds come from?' 28. "`An enemy did this,' he replied. "The servants asked him, `Do you want us to go and pull them up?' 29. "`No,' he answered, `because while you are pulling the weeds, you may root up the wheat with them. 30. Let both grow together until the harvest. At that time I will tell the harvesters: First collect the weeds and tie them in bundles to be burned; then gather the wheat and bring it into my barn.'" NIV Matthew 13:36-43
36. Then he left the crowd and went into the house. His disciples came to him and said, "Explain to us the parable of the weeds in the field."
37. He answered, "The one who sowed the good seed is the Son of Man. 38. The field is the world, and the good seed stands for the sons of the kingdom. The weeds are the sons of the evil one, 39. and the enemy who sows them is the devil. The harvest is the end of the age, and the harvesters are angels. 40. "As the weeds are pulled up and burned in the fire, so it will be at the end of the age. 41. The Son of Man will send out his angels, and they will weed out of his kingdom everything that causes sin and all who do evil. 42. They will throw them into the fiery furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. 43. Then the righteous will shine like the sun in the kingdom of their Father. He who has ears, let him hear. |
THE BOOK OF ALMA
THE SON OF ALMACHAPTER 46Amalickiah conspires to be kingMoroni raises the title of libertyHe rallies the people to defend their religionTrue believers are called ChristiansA remnant of Joseph shall be preservedAmalickiah and the dissenters flee to the land of NephiThose who will not support the cause of freedom are put to death.Between 73 and 72 B.C.
All forms of the word CHRISTIAN in the Text of the Scriptures, sorted by relevance.
13 And he fastened on his head-plate, and his abreastplate, and his shields, and girded on his armor about his loins; and he took the pole, which had on the end thereof his rent coat, (and he called it the btitle of liberty) and he cbowed himself to the earth, and he prayed mightily unto his God for the blessings of liberty to rest upon his brethren, so long as there should a band of dChristians remain to possess the land 15 And those who did belong to the church were afaithful; yea, all those who were true believers in Christ btook upon them, gladly, the name of Christ, or cChristians as they were called, because of their belief in Christ who should come.16 And therefore, at this time, Moroni prayed that the cause of the Christians, and the afreedom of the land might be favored.26 And when he had found him, he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they aassembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called bChristians first in cAntioch.10 And thus he was preparing to asupport their liberty, their lands, their wives, and their children, and their peace, and that they might live unto the Lord their God, and that they might maintain that which was called by their enemies the cause of bChristians.
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This must be a MORMON teaching; for the Word of GOD states otherwise...
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Now it seem you can resort and retort but I am not suppose to comment on the obvious because that would be making it personal or minding or what ever the heck!
But it has become quite apparent you have no idea why this was posted to you it was just another opportunity to obsess and vent.
Well this has nothing to do with LDS it was just something I decided to share!
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/chat/2219811/posts?page=2313#2313
so long as there should a band of dChristians remain to possess the land
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In 600 BC !!!??????????????
I am not suppose to comment on the obvious because that would be making it personal or minding
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Those deleted posts...was that you ????
About making it personal...
It’s not the fault of any Inman that Joey Smith was a lecherous occultist and thievin, murderin’ charlatan who wrote a book full of bad science fiction, as a way to make some quick bucks, and debauched lots of little girls...plus other men’s wives...
The evil that was Joey Smith’s life happened over one hundred years before any of us were born...
You can disagree with the facts, (though how and why anyone would is beyond me) but you cant call people who are not Beatlemania-type fans of Joey Smith’s, ugly names...
You can, however, say things like...”Those Inmans are able to read for themselves” and “Those Inmans are smart enough to figure out mormonism is pagan and not related to Christianity”
ask the Religion moderator
ask him/her what ???
WOW I’m now numbered among some of the best of the FReepers...
I take that as a complement...
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