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To: refreshed

“I am very sorry to tell you so, but I’ll easily take what the scriptures have clearly put forth over the quotes of the commentators of that same scripture.

Y’all are simply not bring Christ down every eucharist to eat his body and blood. He is sitting on the right hand of the Father, waiting for the time of his return as the conquering Christ.”

I agree. Well put.


16 posted on 06/13/2009 7:30:06 PM PDT by swmobuffalo ("We didn't seek the approval of Code Pink and MoveOn.org before deciding what to do")
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To: swmobuffalo
John 10:9 I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture. Which Catholic dogma comes from this verse?

Many Catholic teachings can be linked to this verse, including the Catholic teachings on grace. You might be surprised that the Catholic Church agrees with Protestants that we can only be saved by the grace of Christ's sacrifice and only if we put our faith in His sacrifice.

Where we part ways is that Catholics reject the Protestant doctrine of sola fide. Faith alone is not enough. First, you need grace, and then that grace is justified through works, through which we are sanctified.

So, we Catholics fully assimilate and accept the Scripture you cite. But as a Protestant who believes in sola fide, you have a hard time explaining these verses:

Jas. 2:14-26:
What good is it my brothers, if a man claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save him?...You see that a person is justified by what he does and not by faith alone...faith without deeds is dead.”

Mat. 7:21:
Not everone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.

Pretty clear cut. Yes, you need faith. But faith without action is not true faith. And neither is possible without grace.

Just look at Obama. He can talk a good game about reducing abortions, but his action speak more loudly than his words.

Same with John 5:15. Yes, of course, Christ is the vine and we are the branches. But try to reconcile this passage with the Protestant notion that faith alone is enough, and you have some problems. If one does not attest to one's faith through action, one is not abiding in Christ, just pretending to. Those branches get cast into the fire.

More later...
32 posted on 06/13/2009 9:18:39 PM PDT by bdeaner (The bread which we break, is it not a participation in the body of Christ? (1 Cor. 10:16))
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