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To: wildlybamboozled; Tennessee Nana
Bamboozled, it appears that you are very uninformed about your church.

JS never tried for president.

Joseph Smith for President

    In 1844 the Council of Fifty decided to run Joseph Smith for the presidency of the United States. Klaus J. Hansen said that "the Council of Fifty, while seriously contemplating the possibility of emigration, also considered a rather spectacular alternative, namely, to run its leader for the presidency of the United States in the campaign of 1844.... Smith and the Council of Fifty seems to have taken the election quite seriously, much more so, indeed, than both Mormons and anti-Mormons have heretofore suspected" (Quest for Empire, p.74).

    The elders of the church were actually called to electioneer for Joseph Smith. At a special meeting of the elders on April 9, 1844, Brigham Young declared: "It is now time to have a President of the United States. Elders will be sent to preach the Gospel and electioneer" (History of the Church, vol. 6, p.322). At the same meeting Heber C. Kimball affirmed: "... we design to send Elders to all the different States to get up meetings and protracted meetings, and electioneer for Joseph to be the next President" (Ibid., p.325). Mormon writer John J. Stewart refers to those who were sent to campaign as a "vast force of political missionaries" (Joseph Smith the Mormon Prophet, p.209).

    Under the date of January 29, 1844, this statement is attributed to Joseph Smith in the History of the Church, "If you attempt to accomplish this, you must send every man in the city who is able to speak in public throughout the land to electioneer.... There is oratory enough in the Church to carry me into the presidential chair the first slide" (vol. 6, p.188).

    On March 7, 1844, Joseph Smith was reported to have said: "When I get hold of the Eastern papers, and see how popular I am, I am afraid myself that I shall be elected..." (History of the Church, vol. 6, p.243).

    The fact that Joseph Smith would allow himself to be crowned king shows that he was driven by the idea of gaining power. It is very possible that Smith seriously believed that he would become president and that he would rule as king over the people of the United States. The attempt by Joseph Smith to become president seems to have been a treasonous plot to bring the United States Government under the rule of the priesthood. Klaus J. Hansen observed: "But what if, through a bold stroke, he could capture the United States for the Kingdom? The Council of Fifty thought there might be a chance and nominated the Mormon prophet for the Presidency of the United States" (Dialogue: A Journal of Mormon Thought, Autumn 1966, p.67).

    George Miller, who had been a member of the Council of Fifty, recorded in a letter dated June 28, 1855:

It was further determined in Council that all the elders should set out on missions to all the States to get up an electorial [sic] ticket, and do everything in our power to have Joseph elected president. If we succeeded in making a majority of the voters converts to our faith, and elected Joseph president, in such an event the dominion of the Kingdom would be forever established in the United States; and if not successful, we could fall back on Texas, and be a kingdom notwithstanding (Letter by George Miller, as quoted in Joseph Smith and World Government, by Hyrum Andrus, 1963, p.54).

    Instead of going to Texas the Mormons settled in the Great Salt Lake valley. Hyrum Andrus admits that Smith had even "considered the alternative of establishing the Saints in the capacity of an independent nation, should all other alternatives fail" (Ibid., p.60).

    Before the election Joseph Smith was assassinated. Thus he was unable to establish the kingdom he had planned.

 

 

“I Will Be a Second Mohammed”

In the heat of the Missouri “Mormon War” of 1838, Joseph Smith made the following claim, “I will be to this generation a second Mohammed, whose motto in treating for peace was ‘the Alcoran [Koran] or the Sword.’ So shall it eventually be with us—‘Joseph Smith or the Sword!’[1] 

It is most interesting that a self-proclaimed Christian prophet would liken himself to Mohammed, the founder of Islam. His own comparison invites us to take a closer look as well. And when we do, we find some striking—and troubling—parallels. Consider the following.

  • Mohammed and Joseph Smith both had humble beginnings. Neither had formal religious connections or upbringing, and both were relatively uneducated. Both founded new religions by creating their own scriptures. In fact, followers of both prophets claim these scriptures are miracles since their authors were the most simple and uneducated of men.[2]

  • Both prophets claim of having angel visitations, and of receiving divine revelation to restore pure religion to the earth again. Mohammed was told that both Jews and Christians had long since corrupted their scriptures and religion. In like manner, Joseph Smith was told that all of Christianity had become corrupt, and that consequently the Bible itself was no longer reliable. In both cases, this corruption required a complete restoration of both scripture and religion. Nothing which preceded either prophet could be relied upon any longer. Both prophets claim they were used of God to restore eternal truths which once existed on earth, but had been lost due to human corruption.

  • Both prophets created new scripture which borrowed heavily from the Bible, but with a substantially new “spin.” In his Koran, Mohammed appropriates a number of Biblical themes and characters—but he changes the complete sense of many passages, claiming to “correct” the Bible. In so doing he changes many doctrines, introducing his own in their place. In like manner, Joseph Smith created the Book of Mormon, much of which is plagiarized directly from the King James Bible. Interestingly, the Book of Mormon claims that this same Bible has been substantially corrupted and is therefore unreliable. In addition, Joseph Smith went so far as to actually create his own version of the Bible itself, the “Inspired Version,” in which he both adds and deletes significant portions of text, claiming he is “correcting” it. In so doing he also changes many doctrines, introducing his own in their place.

  • As a part of their new scriptural “spin,” both prophets saw themselves as prophesied in scripture, and both saw themselves as a continuation of a long line of Biblical prophets. Mohammed saw himself as a continuation of the ministry of Moses and Jesus. Joseph Smith saw himself as a successor to Enoch, Melchizedek, Joseph and Moses. Joseph Smith actually wrote himself into his own version of the Bible—by name.

  • Both prophets held up their own scripture as superior to the Bible. Mohammed claimed that the Koran was a perfect copy of the original which was in heaven. The Koran is therefore held to be absolutely perfect, far superior to the Bible and superceding it. In like manner, Joseph Smith also made the following claim. “I told the Brethren that the Book of Mormon was the most correct of any book on earth, and the keystone of our religion, and a man would get nearer to God by abiding its precepts, than by any other book.”[3]

  • Despite their claim that the Bible was corrupt, both prophets admonished their followers to adhere to its teachings. An obvious contradiction, this led to selective acceptance of some portions and wholesale rejection of others. As a result, the Bible is accepted by both groups of followers only to the extent that it agrees with their prophet’s own superior revelation.

  • Both Mohammed and Joseph Smith taught that true salvation was to be found only in their respective religions. Those who would not accept their message were considered “infidels,” pagans or Gentiles. In so doing, both prophets became the enemy of genuine Christianity, and have led many people away from the Christ of the Bible.

  • Both prophets encountered fierce opposition to their new religions and had to flee from town to town because of threats on their lives. Both retaliated to this opposition by forming their own militias. Both ultimately set up their own towns as model societies.

  • Both Mohammed and Joseph Smith left unclear instructions about their successors. The majority of Mohammed’s followers, Sunni Muslims, believe they were to elect their new leader, whereas the minority, Shiite Muslims, believe Mohammed’s son was to be their next leader. Similarly, the majority of Joseph Smith’s followers, Mormons, believed their next prophet should have been the existing leader of their quorum of twelve apostles, whereas the minority, RLDS, believed Joseph Smith’s own son should have been their next prophet. Differences on this issue, and many others, have created substantial tension between these rival groups of each prophet.

  • Mohammed taught that Jesus was just another of a long line of human prophets, of which he was the last. He taught that he was superior to Christ and superceded Him. In comparison, Joseph Smith also made the following claim.

“I have more to boast of than ever any man had. I am the only man that has ever been able to keep a whole church together since the days of Adam. A large majority of the whole have stood by me. Neither Paul, John, Peter, nor Jesus ever did it. I boast that no man ever did such a work as I. The followers of Jesus ran away from Him, but the Latter-day Saints never ran away from me yet.”[4] In light of these parallels, perhaps Joseph Smith’s claim to be a second Mohammed unwittingly became his most genuine prophecy of all.


[1] Joseph Smith made this statement at the conclusion of a speech in the public square at Far West, Missouri on October 14, 1838. This particular quote is documented in Fawn M. Brodie, No Man Knows My History, second edition, (New York: Alfred A. Knopf, 1971), p. 230–231. Fawn Brodie’s footnote regarding this speech contains valuable information, and follows. “Except where noted, all the details of this chapter [16] are taken from the History of the [Mormon] Church. This speech, however, was not recorded there, and the report given here is based upon the accounts of seven men. See the affidavits of T.B. Marsh, Orson Hyde, George M. Hinkle, John Corrill, W.W. Phelps, Samson Avard, and Reed Peck in Correspondence, Orders, etc., pp. 57–9, 97–129. The Marsh and Hyde account, which was made on October 24, is particularly important. Part of it was reproduced in History of the [Mormon] Church, Vol. III, p. 167. See also the Peck manuscript, p. 80. Joseph himself barely mentioned the speech in his history; see Vol. III, p. 162.”

[2] John Ankerberg & John Weldon, The Facts on Islam, (Eugene, OR: Harvest House Publishers, 1998), pp.8–9. Eric Johnson, Joseph Smith  & Muhammed, (El Cajon, CA: Mormonism Research Ministry, 1998), pp. 6–7.

[3] Documentary History of the [Mormon] Church, vol.4, pp.461.

[4] Documentary History of the [Mormon] Church, vol.6, pp.408–409.

 

"Maybe back then it was needed because our Church needed more children because every day more members were being KILLED and raped in the case of women, by mobs.

The actual number of Mormons who were killed solely because of their religious beliefs is very few, if any at all. Mormon leaders and apologists routinely cite a few historical incidents as "religious persecution," when in fact they really weren't.

For instance, the most oft-cited incident was the Haun's Mill massacre during the Missouri War of 1838. However, that occurred not because of religious persecution, but because of the Mormons' attempts to drive all non-Mormons out of western Missouri so they could have the area for themselves.

 
No one at Haun's Mill was killed because of Boggs' order.  Militia officers in the field didn't even receive Boggs' order until after the
Haun's Mill tragedy occurred.

The Haun's Mill massacre was committed on October 30 by an unauthorized militia
band who acted in retaliation for the Mormon Danite raids on their towns of
Millport, Gallatin, and Grinder's Fork (which had been ordered directly by
Joseph Smith, Jr.,) and the Danites' attack on other state militia troops at
Crooked River on October 25. " 

"No one knows who ordered the attack on Haun's Mill.  The militia companies
that participated in the assault belonged to General Parks' brigade, but he did
not issue the order.  The troops were organized under the command of Col.
Thomas Jennings, who apparently acted on his own initiative in leading the
attack.  It is possible that the Missourians received word of Governor Boggs'
extermination order and took it upon themselves to carry out the decree, but
they never offered this as a reason for the raid.


(One problem with this theory is that there is no evidence indicating when
Governor Boggs' order became known to the Missourians.  Generals Jackson,
Doniphan, and Lucas did not receive their orders from the governor until the
afternoon of 30 October, and they did not receive an official copy of the
extermination order until 31 October.)


"One of the attackers, Charles Ashby, a state legislator from Livingston, said
the Missourians attacked because Mormon dissenters fleeing into Livingston
warned them that the Saints at Haun's Mill were planning an invasion of their
county.  Local citizens decided they must act to prevent Mormon soldiers from
overruning Livingston County as they had done Daviess.  'We thought it best to
attack them first,' Ashby told fellow legislators.  'What we did was in our own
defence, and we had the right to do so.'


"The Livingston troops were joined by companies from Daviess and Carroll
counties,  Many of the Daviess men wanted to even the score for Mormon
depradations in their county.  Capts. Nehemiah Comstock and William Mann, whose
troops had been harassing Mormon emigrants and settlers, also brought their
troops into the field."

("The 1838 Mormon War in Missouri," Stephen LeSeuer, U. of Missouri Press, pp.
163-164.)

Another case the mormons refer to is the murder of apostle Parley P. Pratt. Most mormons believe that Pratt was "assassinated by an anti-Mormon while on a mission in Arkansas," but the fact is that Pratt was killed by the estranged husband of one of Pratt's "plural wives." The killer, Hector McLean, didn't want his children by his wife, Eleanor, to be taken to Utah to be raised in polygamy, so he lured Pratt to Arkansas and murdered him.

Whatever the total number of Mormons killed by "persecutors" throughout the entire history of the church, it's far less than the 120 innocent non-Mormon emigrants whom the Mormons massacred in one day at Mountain Meadows in 1857.

Perhaps some study would be of help to youo.

56 posted on 07/12/2009 1:29:56 PM PDT by greyfoxx39 (There is no justice at the Dept. of Justice when Black Panthers are cleared for terrorizing voters.)
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To: greyfoxx39; wildlybamboozled

I think wildlybamboozed is a recent convert...

and so does not know much...

She’s been kept in the dark and fed on “milk” and told that the milk is all she needs...

Thus the name is a self fulfilling prophecy...

The addition of “easily” would help too...

However Christians are told not to accept ignorance of the things of God but to study and read and learn ...

And I gave my heart to seek and search out by wisdom concerning all things that are done under heaven: this sore travail has God given to the sons of man to be exercised therewith. Ecclesiasttes 1:13

For Ezra had devoted himself to the study and observance of the Law of the LORD, and to teaching its decrees and laws in Israel. Ezra 7:10

Now the Bereans were of more noble character than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true. Acts 17:11

Now I would not have you ignorant, brethren, Romans 1:13

I do not want you to be ignorant of this mystery, brothers, Romans 11:25

Brothers and sisters, we don’t want you to be ignorant 1 Thessalonians 4:13

Study to show yourself approved to God, a workman that needs not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. 2 Timothy 2:15

However, the person who continues to study God’s perfect teachings that make people free and who remains committed to them will be blessed. People like that don’t merely listen and forget; they actually do what God’s teachings say. James 1:25


57 posted on 07/12/2009 1:52:52 PM PDT by Tennessee Nana
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