It’s not riling me up, it’s that I don’t want to derail a thread (as all too often happens on FR).
Yeah, I could learn “our Father” in Latin. So? Why not Swahili? Spanish? Mandarin Chinese? Not knowing any of them enough to really _understand_ anything expressed therein, all I would know is little more than a musical sequence with a familiar text imputed thereto.
It’s not that I fear the unknown. I just don’t see the point of insisting on pushing people into it. OK, so the liturgy is in Latin. So? God did not command it. Laypersons do not understand it. Rationalizations sound nice, but appear as little more than just that: rationalizations. Again, why not in Spanish?
The transcendent part of written words are the point: if you understand the language, the transcendent parts are apparent; if you don’t, all you’re doing is mapping rote memorization onto little other than music. The tune sounds different, but again there is little inherent superiority. If you’re looking for transcendence in written language, then go back to the language of the Chosen People - Hebrew - which at least has some inkling of inherent superiority (among other reasons, as indicated in the book The Bible Code).
As for praying to the deceased: nothing in Scripture hints at that as meaningful, advocated, or acceptable. Lacking even the slightest suggestion thereof in The Word, I can only presume the practice is a manmade concoction.
That a church’s traditions may “go astray” just emphasizes the importance of inerrancy and sufficiency of Scripture: such matters are too important to assume God distributes post-Biblical material solely thru such proven fallible conduits, indistinguishable from Man’s own concoctions.
I’m looking for an explanation of the vital importance of Latin, that it is so superior that the costs thereof (opacity of liturgy) is worthwhile. Don’t get me entirely wrong, I’m sure the practice makes for an aesthetically pleasing experience (I’m rather fond of listening to Gregorian Chant), but as worship it seems empty.
Thank you for sharing your thoughts.
Why “our Father” or the Mass, in Latin, and not in other languages you asked? Think about it. Latin is the universal mother tongue of the church, has been for a long time. The Latin Mass is understood anywhere in the world, also that is a unifying force for us Catholics. That’s a good enough trump, over other languages.
Surely you attended weddings and funerals where the well-known Ave Maria was sung and, you understood pretty well everything in it as you do in English. Don’t let others dumb down on you.
On a side note, even for a new convert to learn Latin for worship is a good thing. We, as educated people these days learn new languages all the time, tho not necessary for worship, or in “spoken language” in the strictest sense. Look at all the computer students in universities and colleges. You realize how many new languages (sometimes in complicated codes) they learn and use everyday? Don’t tell me they couldn’t handle Latin if they wanted to.
Now the more troubling issue of your wanting to cite Scriptures to justify praying for the dead. They are there but I don’t have it off hand, Macabees is one of them. Frankly, this is a Protestant train of thought, very scary. The Scriptures came out of the Church, the Church didn’t come of Scriptures, only churches (denominations) are made up from defective Protestant scriptures. Sorry I had to be blunt. Too bad, the Protestants constantly wanting to re-invent the wheel. We Catholics have it made, we have all the Truth necessary for salvation handed down to us thru the centuries.
Praying for the dead is also a derivative of the teaching of Communion of Saints, a teaching that is to be held be all believing catholics. The CCC has a few reference on it as well.
Good question.
"Lex Orandi, lex credendi". Strictly translated -- the Law of Prayer is the Law of Belief. Loosely but accurately translated -- how one prays reflects what he believes.
Frankly, we couldn't afford NOT to do the Latin Mass, in light of what the Vatican II experience brought us in the past 50 years. Judge a tree by its fruits. Would you honestly say that the spiritual/liturgical life of the past 50 years in the Church has been good? Not me.
When Latin Mass was the standard, Catholics everywhere at least believed the same things, sinners that we are. But now? Latest survey indicates 67% of Catholics don't believe in the Real Presence! For that, they can't be called Catholics, technically speaking, but Apostates.
Hopefully, with the unifying force and no-nonsense nature of the Latin Mass, Catholics will become real Catholics once again, and be proud of it.
The catholic Woodstock of Vatican II must come to an end soon.