Gunning for Godfried? Belgian abuse probe asks what Danneels knew

I hear constant talk of "zero tolerance" and "new policies" yet the leadership in the church continues to impede justice as was the case here.

This is nothing more than a little quibble around the edges, but I DO think that many, including many Catholics, don't understand the nature of the Catholic polity. (Not that I understand it much ...)

There isn't any leadership in the manner that the Dear Leader is (or ought to be) the leader of the Executive branch of our government or the way the president or chairman of the board is the leader of a corporation.

I think that we respond to the concept of monarchy, empire, or autocracy too emotionally to understand the hodge-podge of special relationships, exceptions, indults, etc., etc that characterize a huge and old empire.

I began to get the hint of a clue when I tried to track down the whole, centuries-long, Guelph and Ghibelline strife, and its relationship to the strife between empire and papacy.

To us in our blessed age of freedom (more or less) the idea of a bishop having temporal authority is repellent. But it was this authority which, in a secular sense, prevented utter civil domination of religion, and the "common people" found some freedom in the opposition of bishop and king or of pope and emperor.

In any event, it is not just words to say that the Pope is, inter alia, the head of the college of bishops. Bishops are not simply the pope's inferiors; they are also in a sense his colleagues, and they all take this seriously.

So, for example, the calling of an "ecumenical council" is the pope punting to the whole "college" the major issues facing the Church. YEAH, the pope does what he can to make things come out his way, but nonethless there is give and take.

ANYWAY, what that comes down to is that a gawdawful bishop can go on being gawdawful for a long time before the pope will have "clear and convincing evidence" to do serious chain yanking. It is pretty much nuclear war to hoist a bishop.

NOT EXCUSING, just explaining, or trying to.

As someone who went through the ordination process in the Episcopal Church, I am well aware of how a psychopath can deceive the diagnostic shrinks, and of how, despite lots of enquiries, the involved committees can know very little about the people they pass for ordination.

And a parish pastor, as long as his people don't write the bishop or the Pope, can get away with quite a lot. Often the congregation enables him. My predecessor in a mission in Mississippi frequently engaged in sex with a few women in the congregation. The very gifts that got him into their beds also wrapped many in the congregation around his finger. One of them was shocked when I asked why nobody told the bishop! It was a brand new idea to him that both the priest and the congregation needed help and episcopal intervention.

And when the bishop goes bad ... it's pretty bad.

And on the flip side, these days if a congregant doesn't like his priest and is a good liar, his word alone is enough to get a priest removed from the parish and slammed into a "rehab" program that, while a good thing if he IS an abuser, is like a soviet investigation if he is unjustly accused.

"Though with a scornful wonder, men see her (the Church) sore oppressed, ..." It's ugly and sad, and will remain so for a while yet.

Do not mention Freepmail content on thread.

I’ve had it with the language. Leave the thread.

Any thoughts on Post #23?

"Hypocrite" is now within the rules, I take it?

23 and 25 were removed for personal attacks.

21 and 24 were removed for making private Freepmails public.

20 was removed for language

28 was removed for picking at the scab.

Now, discuss the issues all you want but DO NOT make it personal.

A very good summation of the challenges and problems the Church faces. Thank you.

Kind of you to say so. Thanks. Praise God.

Been mulling this over for a few days, now.

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Specifically, what can be done about Freepmail which is a) unsolicited and b) abusive?

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