Posted on 07/11/2010 12:05:34 PM PDT by ConservativeMind
"On behalf of the Catholic Church in El Salvador and society in general, we ask Mr. President to use his executive power to veto the decree referred to upholding the rule of law and democracy of our Salvadoran society"
The Episcopal Conference of El Salvador (CEDES) demanded on Sunday the president Mauricio Funes veto a legislative decree that compels us to read the Bible in schools, believing that "violates" the "religious freedom" enshrined in the Constitution.
The CEDES Funes makes the call under in the coming days must be punished, veto or observe the legislative decree 411 which provides read the Bible in classrooms to combat violence.
The education of children in the faith, according to the bishops, "is a right and duty" of parents, aided by ministers of religion.
"We are interested in reading the Bible, but not as imposing liability in the schools, hopefully becoming more read the Bible is more understood, more practiced," says the shepherd.
(Excerpt) Read more at translate.google.com ...
YeaH, I thought so as well...some points not yet clear, I need to look closer at... but all in all very interesting.
No such thing as apostolic succession in the NT church ...
Cause that is what they are told to believe.. isn't that enough for you?
“Education should be private.”
I’ll agree with you there. Possibly I could go with literacy and citizenship classes provided by the government, with the justification that they need a literate citizenship that knows their rights and responsibilities.
But as long as it is public, there is a religion being taught. The prevailing religion being taught today is secular humanism. That is the dominant religion of this nation, in my opinion. It must be stopped, and I advocate Christianity to stop it. Bible reading is a good start.
St. Paul was talking about preaching. He spoke about Christ to his hearers, personally, engaging in debate, answering questions, delivering his testimony. He didn’t expect that reading state-chosen selections of the Bible to schoolchildren would transform the society of the Roman Empire.
I kind of agree with that on "principle in a vacuum," as it were. However, that's the justification used by our government, and yet it's clear that our *rulers* in fact have a vested interest in an illiterate subject population that has no concept of legitimate rights or any responsibilities ... and conveniently, that's what our government schools produce in large numbers. This tells us something about government.
As to your second paragraph, we're not talking about the US. The subject is El Salvador. Although I know a couple dozen Salvadorans, I know nothing about what public schools are like in their home country.
On principle, I do not like mixing government with religion. Satan quotes Scripture to his purposes, and so can government. Make the subjects pacificist, or make them theocratic-militarist. Make them obedient to the state, or make them detached from political involvement. Make them accept polygamy or incest. All of that can be done if they take their religion just from the excerpts of the Bible the state chooses to present.
The original post, describing the bible reading in El Salvador, reeks with the mendacity usually served in these anti Catholic threads. Notice how once challenged regarding the validity and misleading nature of their duplicity these anti christian bigots fall to support their mendacious contentions which fall like lightning from the sky. These alleged Christians have used pagan tactics for years but as Christ commanded we must love all.
<< Romans 10 >>
1Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved. 2For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge. 3For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God. 4For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
5For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them. 6But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above:) 7Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.) 8But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;
9That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. 10For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. 11For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed. 12For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him. 13For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
14How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher? 15And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!
16But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report? 17So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
Paul preached the word.. that is what saves
The literal Greek translation says "so then the faith is by a report, and the report through a saying of God,"
I have read a study that the majority of Catholics do not believe they are receiving the actual body of Christ some years ago, I believe from a Catholic source, I also have read that Catholics have more abortions than Protestants.. but the rest is pretty new to me
Indeed - the Bible, and what he told them it meant. The Jewish people had the Old Testament, all that there was of “Scripture” at the time. Jesus said to their teachers, “You search the Scriptures, thinking that in them you have eternal life, and yet it is they that testify to Me.” Even today, Jews and Christians read the same Old Testament, and draw drastically different conclusions from it.
The benefit of Bible readings, unsupported by anything else, is tenuous from a religious perspective. From a “language arts” perspective, it is all gain if they use an excellent Spanish version. The one I have is the “middle school” version, I think, compared to what I hear some of our other parishioners reading. In English, I use the RSV, but my Spanish is not up to that level of subtle vocabulary.
Now these people are all professionals...attended Mass faithfully and often spoke of this. How much they enjoyed it. “Faithful” catholics as one might say. But they had little if any understanding of the scriptures. “Too hard to understand”...and one actually asked “What does it mean to be born again”. You can bet those of us Christians wasted no time praying then and explained to her what this is.
My point is the four of us Christians spoke freely about Christ and the things of God. The catholics offered little to these conversations and clearly were awkward trying to ... generally asked more questions. They were illiterate of the things of God for the most part. Their faith rested entirely on belonging to the church alone...and that is generally how it is when I speak with catholics....FR is the exception to that and greatly so. At the least they know what their church teaches and most understand why they believe what they do...even if we disagree.
ROTFL!
Oh, yeah, that’s the most cogent response of the Catholics on this thread.
I love it when Catholics can’t take it.
By the way, 90+% of El Salvador is Catholic, and I’M FOR THE CATHOLIC TAKE ON THIS IN CLASSROOMS AS LONG AS THE BIBLE IS STRICTLY BEING READ FROM!
I’ve stated that in prior posts and someone like you says the crazy things you do.
Catholics.
Perhaps the poster has a more substantive answer, but i will check back tomorrow. Have a God night.
The Bible is a book, not a person.
If it speaks for itself, then it hasn't spoken very clearly, since there manifestly is widespread disagreement as to what it says.
Even if we stipulate that your premise is unproblematic, it is impossible for teachers or anyone else to refrain from comment on something as important as Scripture. Even the tone of voice in which it is read will convey much information about the reader's estimation.
The fact that in this case the passages read will be carefully prescreened by a government agency indicates that bias is already at work.
The Bible is not intended to be a tool of worldly policy.
Sola Ecclesia Romanus
Only the Church of Rome is the Rule of Faith
Joh 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
YOu completely ignore the possibility that the Holy Spirit may have some say in the matter...
The bible is not a novel...It's a spiritual book...
Do you agree the first bible message should be from the Apocrypha of the OT since the protestant types have been deprived of God's word for so many years?
Here's the real verse...
Joh 5:38 And ye have not his word abiding in you: for whom he hath sent, him ye believe not.
Joh 5:39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.
The verse is a command to 'search the scriptures'...Search the scriptures because you think you have eternal life even tho you do not have His WORDS abiding in you...
God says you're wrong...
That is why Christians need to have an authoritative source not some self imagined visit from the Holy Spirit where wild imaginations rule the day.
Twice in a row, you're wrong...And I guess we can take that as confirmation that you are not indwelt with the Holy Spirit and are not led by the Spirit as well...
By believing agenda driven anti-Christian statistical sites I can discern your visits have been from the darker side and so you must attack what is of God by attacking His Bride.
Without the Holy Spirit, you have no Spiritual discernment...
Pay attention to post 116...All the characteristics you diss are the characteristics of a Christian, according to the God of the scriptures...
Make that post 118...It will help you in the long run...Read the surrounding verses (in a bible) as well...
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