Posted on 08/10/2010 2:09:49 PM PDT by Viking83
Have you ever read the book, “Revelation, Four Views” A parallel Commentary?
It was written by Steve Cregg, a former pretrib dispensationalist.
He and Hank Hanegraaff’s understanding is close to yours.
Yes, I have...and just about every thing else written on the subject. Hank Hanegraaf is a Preterist. Of which (Preterism), I believe is twilight zone stuff. Heresy, in my opinion.
Actually he doesn’t, even though he is often times accused of such. The best that can be said is he is a half Preterist, because many things the Preterism beliefs he disagrees with. For one thing he vehemently denies Christ ever returned the 2nd time as pretists do.
I understand where he comes from even if I do not agree with everything he thinks on eschatology, but a lot of what you espoused above is what he does.
You really should look back into what he leans towards, many who have attacked him have labeled him with the Preterism label but they are wrong.
It is like those who claim he is a cessationismt, but he is not. He just does not believe the gifts of the tongue, etc. etc. are not as prevalent as many modern evangelicals claim.
Where many come in disagreement with Hank is his disbelief in the rapture of the church, or the separate prophecy for the church verses that of the Jews. He believe that the Church replaced the Jewish religion as the proper and true bearers of the covenant with God. Such as unless you accept Christ you cannot be saved.
Now because he does not believe in the rapture of the church, he does not agree with many of the prophecies that come along with the pretrib or the posttrib teachings. That is where he gets into trouble with man modern day evangelicals.
It must be taken into consideration that before the Scofield Bible, a very small minority even believed in the rapture as we know it today. However, the Scofield Bible was the most read Bible by the turn of the 19 century and everyone was getting his understanding of the prophecies. Many of the following teache4rs of dispensationalism followed his understanding as they went on to seminaries and thus taught his teachings.
The impact of Scofield cannot be ignored when considering eschatology after the early 1900’s. Now 95% of all seminary schools teach the same as Darby and Scofield.
I personally lean in the direction of dispensationalism, but I often question pow much was because of many years of repeating such teachings in not just religious circles, but also secular Movies, and literature.
Thanks, I wasn’t aware of the things you mentioned about Hanaagraf. I don’t keep up with him very much, it has been several years since I listened to his radio program
Is that correct ? Are you suggesting that the Yah'shua was wrong when He said : If I understand your position it is that the Holy Spirit
shalom b'SHEM Yah'shua HaMashiach
had nothing to do with the assembling of the books
of the New Testament. John 14:26 "But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father
I pray that the Roman "church" is not grieving the Holy Spirit.
will send in My name, He will teach you all things,
and bring to your remembrance all that I said to you.
3 To these He also presented Himself alive after His suffering, by many convincing proofs, appearing to them over a period of forty days and speaking of the things concerning the kingdom of God.
4 Gathering them together, He commanded them not to leave Jerusalem, but to wait for what the Father had promised, "Which," He said, "you heard of from Me;
5 for John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now."
6 So when they had come together, they were asking Him, saying, "Lord, is it at this time You are restoring the kingdom to Israel?"
7 He said to them, "It is not for you to know times or epochs which the Father has fixed by His own authority;
Even after Jesus instructed them concerning the Scriptures, after His resurrection, after He was speaking to them things concerning the Kingdom of God ... what did the apostles ask Him? Is now the time you will restore the Kingdom?
They were absolutely expecting Jesus to restore the Kingdom ... He didnt "correct" them and say "OH NO ... the Kingdom is in your heart ... go glorify God and enjoy Him forever" ... but rather, in so many words He simply said "Not now, I have something else in mind until that time comes."
EXACTLY!
When Peter made mistakes before, Jesus rebuked him calling him SATAN! Where is the rebuke here? Where is the "You are the new Kingdom, go out and make it happen for yourselves"
And of course, when talking about the second coming and the tribulation, Paul says:
But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you. [2] For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night. [3] For when they shall say, ‘Peace and safety’; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape. [4] But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief. [5] Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness. [6] Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober. [7] For they that sleep, sleep in the night; and they that be drunken are drunken in the night. [8] But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation. [9] For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ, [10] Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him. [11] Wherefore comfort yourselves together, and edify one another, even as also ye do"
If the Tribulation comes FIRST, how is that ANY Comfort? That's HORRIFIC. We should all be packing salt, beans and Y2K stuff, or teaching our children how to "take two to the chest" like in the movie "Kick Ass". If the Tribulation, Anti-Christ and Mark of the Beast all happens BEFORE the Rapture... we are as far from Comfort as the heathen are from Salvation.
I think you can be pretty certain that someone arrogant enough to have a bumper sticker reading as stated is probably going to still be driving the car.
No.
Was the Holy Spirit guiding the protestants or the Jews when they removed certain books from the established Bible? Old and New Testaments?
No.
Was the Holy Spirit guiding the protestants or the Jews when they removed certain books from the established Bible? Old and New Testaments?
If you are willing to do the research, you will discover
shalom b'SHEM Yah'shua HaMashiach
Yah'shua never cited the extra-biblical books you are referring to.
In 1 Thes. 4:16, regarding when it says "the dead in Christ shall rise first". I believe the dead in Christ are already risen. As Paul said "to be absent the body is to be in the presence of Christ 2Cr 5:8. And if you look at the rest of the passage, it appears that Jesus brings the dead with him to the rapture and the living are caught up to be with them.
1Th 4:13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope. 1Th 4:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him. 1Th 4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive [and] remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. 1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive [and] remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
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