Well of course I told you my interpretation of the stated verses as you have also done, now. We differ on what Jesus was really saying to the "rich, young man". Here is the passage from Matthew:
Matthew 19:16-26
16 Just then a man came up to Jesus and asked, “Teacher, what good thing must I do to get eternal life?”
17 “Why do you ask me about what is good?” Jesus replied. “There is only One who is good. If you want to enter life, keep the commandments.”
18 “Which ones?” he inquired. Jesus replied, “‘You shall not murder, you shall not commit adultery, you shall not steal, you shall not give false testimony,
19 honor your father and mother,’and ‘love your neighbor as yourself.’”
20 “All these I have kept,” the young man said. “What do I still lack?”
21 Jesus answered, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”
22 When the young man heard this, he went away sad, because he had great wealth.
23 Then Jesus said to his disciples, “Truly I tell you, it is hard for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of heaven.
24 Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of God.”
25 When the disciples heard this, they were greatly astonished and asked, “Who then can be saved?”
26 Jesus looked at them and said, “With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.”
So...my question about this episode is did the young man really tell the truth about never breaking any of the commandments? I believe he thought he was as perfect as a man could be. But, we know that Jesus taught that obeying the commandments of God meant more than just the outward acts but the inward as well. He told the Pharisees about hate being as murder, lust the same as adultery, etc. so it is the spirit of the law and not just the letter of the law. My contention is that this man was self-deluded and Jesus pointed out to him his actual sinful state. Notice, too, that nowhere is there a commandment to give everything you have to the poor.
I thought it curious that when the guy asks Jesus "Which ones?" and Jesus listed them, he did not list the first, greatest commandment, "And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.". Did you notice that? When the guy left, dejected, it was as I said, he knew he could never trust Christ that much and his money meant more to him. A person who thinks this way - and not just about money - is really saying they don't believe in God. If they really did think that God was real and that by rejecting him they were condemned to eternity in Hell, how many people would still reject him?
To trust in Jesus Christ for my salvation means that I truly cast myself upon his throne of grace, I will not put anything in my life above him, I surrender my entire self to him, whatever he asks me to do, I will do because he is my Lord and Savior. So I hope you can see now that I have not discounted anything that Jesus was saying here, I just in hindsight can understand his point better than the man in the story or the followers of Jesus did. Even they asked him, "Who then can be saved?". Yikes, they thought even we won't make it if that's what is required. Jesus said, "With man this is IMPOSSIBLE, but with God all things are possible." Man cannot save himself, he can never be as perfect as God and until he sees his need for grace and mercy, he will not ever have eternal life. Just as Jesus said, "There is only one who is good.", and we know he meant God. This man and all mankind must come to the point of realization that no one is as good as God nor can he ever attain it apart from Christ. We will have the righteousness of God through faith in Christ.
II Cor. 5:21
For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.
Well of course I told you my interpretation of the stated verses as you have also done, now.
Your words were: I have told you what the passages are saying - several times now.
If you recall the thread correctly, I was the one who posted the verses so that we could see what they actually said.
We differ on what Jesus was really saying to the "rich, young man". Here is the passage from Matthew:
We sure do. I quoted Jesus. You gave me several expositions.
So...my question about this episode is did the young man really tell the truth about never breaking any of the commandments? I believe he thought he was as perfect as a man could be. But, we know that Jesus taught that obeying the commandments of God meant more than just the outward acts but the inward as well. He told the Pharisees about hate being as murder, lust the same as adultery, etc. so it is the spirit of the law and not just the letter of the law. My contention is that this man was self-deluded and Jesus pointed out to him his actual sinful state. Notice, too, that nowhere is there a commandment to give everything you have to the poor.
Jesus did not point out the man's sinful state anywhere. Jesus accepted his testimony and simply added to the requirements. No command to give to the poor? Matthew 5, 6, and 7 gainsay that statement. Acts of the Apostles also has some very good examples for Christians to follow. But Jesus does not tell us generally to give everything to the poor, but He told this man specifically. The Gospels are full of examples of Christian deeds required of us.
I thought it curious that when the guy asks Jesus "Which ones?" and Jesus listed them, he did not list the first, greatest commandment, "And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.". Did you notice that? When the guy left, dejected, it was as I said, he knew he could never trust Christ that much and his money meant more to him. A person who thinks this way - and not just about money - is really saying they don't believe in God. If they really did think that God was real and that by rejecting him they were condemned to eternity in Hell, how many people would still reject him?
Do not judge this man harshly. Even the Apostles largely abandoned Him to die; even Peter denied Him three times. Do you have the same opinion of them? The man didn't want to give up his wealth; the Apostles abandoned Jesus to the Crucifixion. Do you think that they were more virtuous than the man?
To trust in Jesus Christ for my salvation means that I truly cast myself upon his throne of grace, I will not put anything in my life above him, I surrender my entire self to him, whatever he asks me to do, I will do because he is my Lord and Savior. So I hope you can see now that I have not discounted anything that Jesus was saying here, I just in hindsight can understand his point better than the man in the story or the followers of Jesus did.
I could use terms like impious boasting and hubris here (I am a million times as humble as thou art...). But I won't, because I would simply like to point out that since you are human, you don't. You cannot. You may try and you may succeed or you may fail, but I will submit to you (not evening knowing you - I'd bet any amount though) that you have not surrendered yourself completely to God. There are very few people who even come close. I know that I haven't, not by a long shot. I still have more the RDA of pride and I admit it. I do not boast of what I do not have.
Even they asked him, "Who then can be saved?". Yikes, they thought even we won't make it if that's what is required. Jesus said, "With man this is IMPOSSIBLE, but with God all things are possible." Man cannot save himself, he can never be as perfect as God and until he sees his need for grace and mercy, he will not ever have eternal life. Just as Jesus said, "There is only one who is good.", and we know he meant God. This man and all mankind must come to the point of realization that no one is as good as God nor can he ever attain it apart from Christ. We will have the righteousness of God through faith in Christ.
Back to this? Christianity never believed in self salvation; without God, there is no salvation. Yet all four Gospels make it very plain, Paul makes it plain, Acts makes it plain that there are requirements. Without fulfilling these requirements, there is no salvation. Matthew 25 is very plain.
II Cor. 5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.
Yup, might be. Could be. May be. Depending on our Christian conduct which will be Judged by the Almighty. Since you are again reverting to Paul, let us have some of Paul's wisdom to the Romans in Chapter 2:
1 1 Therefore, you are without excuse, every one of you who passes judgment. 2 For by the standard by which you judge another you condemn yourself, since you, the judge, do the very same things. 2 We know that the judgment of God on those who do such things is true. 3 Do you suppose, then, you who judge those who engage in such things and yet do them yourself, that you will escape the judgment of God? 4 Or do you hold his priceless kindness, forbearance, and patience in low esteem, unaware that the kindness of God would lead you to repentance? 5 By your stubbornness and impenitent heart, you are storing up wrath for yourself for the day of wrath and revelation of the just judgment of God, 6 who will repay everyone according to his works: 3 7 eternal life to those who seek glory, honor, and immortality through perseverance in good works, 8 but wrath and fury to those who selfishly disobey the truth and obey wickedness. 9 Yes, affliction and distress will come upon every human being who does evil, Jew first and then Greek. 10 But there will be glory, honor, and peace for everyone who does good, Jew first and then Greek.
A rhetorical question: will your works stand up to God's Judgement? Or was Paul wrong?