Posted on 12/17/2010 7:31:07 AM PST by marshmallow
By your own words, you are showing that you are the one putting a "human spin" on the Incarnation, i.e., if you can't figure it out, it must not be true. Actually, all the Christological heresies -- Nestorianism, Arianism, Monophysitism, Monothelitism, etc., etc., are attempts to reduce the great Mystery of the Incarnation, always celebrated by the Church in prayer and hymnody, to something mere human reason can understand. Again, reducing Christ to the "manageable."
“HossB86, so what is “the whole Nestorian issue” according to you?”
A blatant attempt to redirect the argument.
All I asked for were scriptural citations showing Mary’s appointment as our co-mediatrix, or co-redemptrix, or barring those, any scripture where Mary “helps” Christ with anything regarding our salvation.
As I’ve stated before: I believe Jesus is fully God and fully man. I don’t know how; is not God omnipotent? I don’t worry about trying to figure out things of which I cannot know.
I am trying to figure out where in scripture all these powers/offices are given to Mary, that’s all! Roman Catholics here on this thread make the claim (or more accurately, their church does)—I’m just waiting for the scriptural authority to show up.
Hoss
Did Iscool say he “had it figured out?” He said if YOU could figure it out you might be onto something. Doesn’t sound like Iscool said he had it figured out.
Seems to me that ol’ habit of putting words into mouths is creeping in again.
Hoss
The clear implication was that since Iscool can't figure it out, it's obvious nonsense. And then he settled back into his utterly carnal (as opposed to spiritual) understanding -- the lazy man's Nestorianism:
Mary provided the flesh for a house for God...
. . . which he states in a downright manner that at least sounds as if he thinks he understands it.
Granted, he's not the most articulate poster, but that's what I got out of it.
Hoss, OK. I get your drift.
Nestorianism is an important and dangerous error that leads to worse errors. But in this case, you may be right.
You’re not going to get Scriptural proof for the role of Mary as co-mediatrix or co-redemptrix or anything like that for the simple reason there isn’t any.
And that, Belteshazzar, is my point.
Thanks.
Hoss
“The clear implication was that since Iscool can’t figure it out, it’s obvious nonsense.”
Really? Not so clear to me. Not at all. I read it as it was written. If that’s what you’re seeing, it seems to me to be a stretch.
“the lazy man’s Nestorianism:
Mary provided the flesh for a house for God...”
Again, this seems to be a misrepresentation. Sorry, but it does.
As for him being inarticulate, I have to disagree heartily. The posts Iscool makes have been cogent.... and cite-able in scripture.
Hoss
Have a happy and blessed Christmas!
And a very Merry and Blessed Christmas to you too!
Hoss
I LOVE your kitty picture....in fact I saved it, it is really cute...your answer to my challenge waqs, as usual totally inane. If you can’t answer a statement....please refrain from posting anything. It will indicate that you missed it, but when you reply with your ususl nonsense, it indicates that you are no more educated than you were the last time you spoke....too bad!!!
No need. God is omnipotent, I will never understand everything He did for me, Christ said, "Before Abraham was, I AM." He saved His own mother before she was born and protected her from all stain of sin. He chose her from all eternity to be His virginal mother, and raised her, at the end of her life, to be with Him forever in Heaven.
Joseph was told by the angel of the Lord, "Take the child and His mother," to Egypt. Not "Take your wife and child." Same thing for their return to Israel. The wise men came and worshiped the Newborn King, NOT his mother. We don't worship His mother either. But we don't ignore the Blessed Virgin, either.
She was the chosen woman. All generations call her blest. No other woman. If you think that all happened by accident, that would be an error. Christ Jesus, one in Being with the God the Father, and God the Holy Spirit did this. We cannot understand it, salvation does not require we understand it, there is no explanation we can parse, and we can either accept it or not.
Anyone trying to separate all this out is going to find him/herself thinking in strictly human terms, asking questions about Mary's sexuality that we have NO RIGHT to ask of Christ the Savior's mother. Speculation about her is a sin, imho. The Blessed Trinity did it, it was Holy, it was Good, and it is none of our business. When God is Incarnated, any attempt to understand the physical mechanism quickly becomes an encroachment on God's privacy, the Mother of God's privacy.
Mary provided the flesh for a house for God...
Nope. GOD provided the enfleshment for His Only Begotten Son. Mary was she, a creation of Almighty God, whom He saved from all stain of sin from the moment of her conception. And of course He can do that.
No need. God is omnipotent, I will never understand everything He did for me, Christ said, "Before Abraham was, I AM." He saved His own mother before she was born and protected her from all stain of sin. He chose her from all eternity to be His virginal mother, and raised her, at the end of her life, to be with Him forever in Heaven.
Joseph was told by the angel of the Lord, "Take the child and His mother," to Egypt. Not "Take your wife and child." Same thing for their return to Israel. The wise men came and worshiped the Newborn King, NOT his mother. We don't worship His mother either. But we don't ignore the Blessed Virgin, either.
She was the chosen woman. All generations call her blest. No other woman. If you think that all happened by accident, that would be an error. Christ Jesus, one in Being with the God the Father, and God the Holy Spirit did this. We cannot understand it, salvation does not require we understand it, there is no explanation we can parse, and we can either accept it or not.
Anyone trying to separate all this out is going to find him/herself thinking in strictly human terms, asking questions about Mary's sexuality that we have NO RIGHT to ask of Christ the Savior's mother. Speculation about her is a sin, imho. The Blessed Trinity did it, it was Holy, it was Good, and it is none of our business. When God is Incarnated, any attempt to understand the physical mechanism quickly becomes an encroachment on God's privacy, the Mother of God's privacy.
Mary provided the flesh for a house for God...
Nope. GOD provided the enfleshment for His Only Begotten Son. Mary was she, a creation of Almighty God, whom He saved from all stain of sin from the moment of her conception. And of course He can do that.
Thanks for continuing to be SO WRONG.
It’s a great advertisement for how off the wall your perspective is.
Let's see now, I agree with the oldest, (original) Christian church in the world (Catholic) and in your never to be humble opinion, I am wrong.....So if I and the Catholic church are wrong, just how and when did you become right???? where and when did the church which Christ founded err and need correction.....point out the error of her ways and what you did to correct them, I can hardly wait to leave Catholicism and join a "what's happening now" protestant denomination.....that way I don't have to get up on Sunday to go to Mass!!!!
NOPE . . .
More RUBBER HISTORY AND RUBBER BIBLE stuff . . .
The Vatican came along about 300-400 years later.
A very slick coup of the bureaucratic power mongering pseudo-theological elite magicsterical pharisees.
And the same drift has been perpetuated and expanded on ever since.
THX BRO.
May The Lord bless you with rich dialogues with those you love . . . in His peace, His provision, His joy, His understanding, His compassion, His empathy, His wholeness, His healing, His guidance, His freedom, His health, His protection.
May your hands be more functional and less painful in the new year.
HUGS HUGS HUGS AND PRAYERS.
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