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Is the Bible the Only Revelation from God?
Bible.org ^ | 2005 | Greg Herrick

Posted on 02/24/2011 2:33:41 PM PST by Natural Law

Introduction

Has God made himself known only in the Bible and/or Jesus? Are there any other ways in which He has revealed himself to us? If so, how? What is the nature, extent, and value of that revelation and how does it compare with the knowledge we have of God through Christ and Scripture? Does everyone inherently know God? If so, in what way(s)? These are just some of the questions we will treat in this brief paper.

Our use of the term “revelation” comes from the Greek term ajpokavluyi" (apokalupsis) and means “to uncover, reveal, disclose,” or “make known” (cf. Rom 16:25; Rev 1:1).1 Therefore, in terms of divine revelation, it is God making himself known to the objects of that revelation, e.g., angels and people. The fact that God must make himself known in order for us to know him is necessary since we are finite and he is infinite, and we are sinful and he is holy.

Those that have studied revelation have suggested that Scripture affirms a two part division to God’s revelation, namely, (1) general, and (2) particular. Some have used the terms (1) general, and (2) special. General revelation refers to God making himself known in creation, providentially orchestrated history, and conscience (i.e., in conjunction with the moral law).2 Thus, it is general in the sense that it is equally available to all men and women, everywhere, all the time, and is less specific information about God than one acquires in special revelation. Special revelation refers to God making himself known through special acts (e.g., signs and miracles), appearances, Christ, and Scripture.


TOPICS: Catholic; Orthodox Christian; Religion & Culture
KEYWORDS: apostolictradition; catholic; caucusremoved; orthodox; solascripturacaucus; truth
This is a Catholic / Orthodox Caucus Thread.

Since the current practice in the Forum is to preemptively lock up and lock out certain topics and posters I am re-posting threads where Latin and Eastern Rite Catholics were denied an oportunity for discussion. In this case the legitimacy of Apostolic Tradition and Appirations as a means of Divine Revelation suggested in the original article can be considered.

1 posted on 02/24/2011 2:33:47 PM PST by Natural Law
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Comment #2 Removed by Moderator

To: Natural Law

I really dont know.Some think not.


3 posted on 02/24/2011 2:37:38 PM PST by dalebert
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Comment #4 Removed by Moderator

To: ReverendJames
I'm sure you would have some interesting contributions on an open thread, but if you are not Latin Rite or Orthodox Catholic this thread is closed to you.
5 posted on 02/24/2011 2:41:45 PM PST by Natural Law
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Comment #7 Removed by Moderator

To: Natural Law

Has God made himself known only in the Bible and/or Jesus? Are there any other ways in which He has revealed himself to us?

The seas, the mountains, the skies, the birds, the trees, the flowers and on and on.


8 posted on 02/24/2011 2:53:32 PM PST by SECURE AMERICA
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Comment #9 Removed by Moderator

To: Natural Law

Has God made himself known only in the Bible and/or Jesus? Are there any other ways in which He has revealed himself to us?

The seas, the mountains, the skies, the birds, the trees, the flowers and on and on.


10 posted on 02/24/2011 2:54:05 PM PST by SECURE AMERICA
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Comment #11 Removed by Moderator

To: Natural Law
Since the current practice in the Forum is to preemptively lock up and lock out certain topics and posters....

So I guess it's probably safe to talk about the Holy Spirit on this thread?

12 posted on 02/24/2011 2:56:27 PM PST by r9etb
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Comment #13 Removed by Moderator

To: Natural Law

I believe it is Catholic (perhaps Orthodox too) teaching that there will be no more public revealation until Christ returns. There can be private revelation and there can be a growth of understanding regarding public revelation but nothing “new”.

God has revealed Himself to us by means other than Scripture. The purpose of this revelation must be emphasized and that is so people will turn to Him and turn to His written, oral and living Word. We call these Scripture, Tradition and Christ. All of which are protected and taught by the Church.

One primary way He has done this is in the glory of Creation. Another is through what is called natural law.
I’m sure there are others. It must be remembered they are not a permenant substitution for the public revelations found in Scripture, Tradition and in the person of Christ, Jesus. They are meant to lead us to the fullness of Truth not to replace it.


14 posted on 02/24/2011 2:58:34 PM PST by lastchance (Hug your babies.)
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To: Natural Law
The bible is the most recent revelation by God but other belief systems may have incorporated prior revelations such as made by Melchizedek.

That Abraham, Melchizedek and Hammurabi existed at about the same time strongly points to prior revelation finding its way into the Code of Hammurabi which itself anticipated the Ten Commandments.

15 posted on 02/24/2011 3:04:20 PM PST by fso301
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To: Natural Law

Nostradamas, Casey, Mayans, tons of fables through the ages.


16 posted on 02/24/2011 3:15:07 PM PST by csuzieque
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To: 5thGenTexan

I think the Bible is just a beginning into His nature, and does represent through Christ the only path to salvation, that life everyday is actually a conversation with the Almighty, we literally walk on His word as it is His word that creates and forms the reality we call life..


17 posted on 02/24/2011 3:30:42 PM PST by aces
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To: lastchance
I’m sure there are others. It must be remembered they are not a permenant substitution for the public revelations found in Scripture, Tradition and in the person of Christ, Jesus. They are meant to lead us to the fullness of Truth not to replace it.

Some would argue (me included) that "Tradition" can be a form of revelation from God, in the sense that it represents the gradual unfolding of His will as we live together within the Body of Christ.

After all, For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them. (Matt. 18:20).

Of course, Tradition can be misused or misconstrued.... as can Scripture.

18 posted on 02/24/2011 3:41:18 PM PST by r9etb
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To: Natural Law

Is anyone sure that God revealed himself?


19 posted on 02/24/2011 3:42:19 PM PST by Cacique (quos Deus vult perdere, prius dementat ( Islamia Delenda Est ))
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To: Cacique
Is anyone sure that God revealed himself?

I am. It's how I became a Christian -- God spoke to me.

(And that's before I paid attention to Scripture.)

20 posted on 02/24/2011 3:44:51 PM PST by r9etb
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To: Natural Law

As I learn more about my Catholic Faith, I feel closer to God and feel his presence and guidance. I especially feel him when receiving His Body and Blood in Holy Communion.

This was an article I read and kept (but forgot to keep the web page reference).

According to a Polish blog, the Metropolitan Curia of Bialystok has announced the results of the investigation of an Ecclesial Commission appointed by Archbishop Edward Ozorowski on March 30, 2009. The original post (in Polish) can be found here.

Father Andrzej Kakareko, Chancellor, writes that on October 12, 2008, a consecrated Host fell out of the hands of the priest distributing Holy Communion. The priest had it picked up and placed in the vasculum in the Tabernacle. After Mass, the vasculum and its contents were transferred to the safe in the sacristy.

Seven days later, after opening the safe, a red stain was seen on the Host. Ten days afer that, the vessel with the Host was transferred to the Tabernacle in the chapel of the rectory. The next day, the Host was removed from the water and placed on the corporal in the Tabernacle.

On January 7, 2009 a sample from the host was sent to the University in Bialystok for analysis. According to two medical professionals, professor Maria Sobaniec-Lotowska and professor Stanislaw Sulkowski, the sample, in their opinion, most resembled the myocardial (heart) tissue of a living organism.

As part of its investigation, the Commission interviewed witnesses and pathomorphology experts. The Commission determined that there was no third-party intervention. The case has been forwarded to the Apostolic Nunciature in Warsaw.

While unusual in this day and age, the Church has a long history of Eucharistic miracles. The Vatican International Exhibition’s “Eucharistic Miracles of the World” documents more than 130 worldwide miracles of the Eucharist, demonstrating that Jesus Christ in the Eucharist – Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity – continues to make his presence manifest at unique times and places in history.

Perhaps the most famous and well-known, is the Miracle of Lanciano, which occurred about 750 A.D. It bears repeating as it closely resembles the alleged Polish miracle. During Mass, the celebrant doubted the Real Presence of Christ in the Eucharist. During the consecration, the Host transformed into flesh and blood. Subsequent investigations confirmed the authenticity of the human tissue. An investigation, as late as 1970, found the flesh to be cardiac tissue and the blood to be type AB.

Eucharistic Miracle
Lanciano, Italy 8th Century A.D.

Ancient Anxanum, the city of the Frentanese, has contained for over twelve centuries the first and greatest Eucharistic Miracle of the Catholic Church. This wondrous Event took place in the 8th century A.D. in the little Church of St. Legontian, as a divine response to a Basilian monk’s doubt about Jesus’ Real Presence in the Eucharist.

During Holy Mass, after the two-fold consecration, the host was changed into live Flesh and the wine was changed into live Blood, which coagulated into five globules, irregular and differing in shape and size.

The Host-Flesh, as can be very distinctly observed today, has the same dimensions as the large host used today in the Latin church; it is light brown and appears rose-colored when lighted from the back.

The Blood is coagulated and has an earthy color resembling the yellow of ochre.

Various ecclesiastical investigation (”Recognitions”) were conducted since 1574.

In 1970-’71 and taken up again partly in 1981 there took place a scientific investigation by the most illustrious scientist Prof. Odoardo Linoli, eminent Professor in Anatomy and Pathological Histology and in Chemistry and Clinical Microscopy. He was assisted by Prof. Ruggero Bertelli of the University of Siena.

The analyses were conducted with absolute and unquestionable scientific precision and they were documented with a series of microscopic photographs.
These analyses sustained the following conclusions:

The Flesh is real Flesh. The Blood is real Blood.

The Flesh and the Blood belong to the human species.

The Flesh consists of the muscular tissue of the heart.

In the Flesh we see present in section: the myocardium, the endocardium, the vagus nerve and also the left ventricle of the heart for the large thickness of the myocardium.

The Flesh is a “HEART” complete in its essential structure.

The Flesh and the Blood have the same blood-type: AB (Blood-type identical to that which Prof. Baima Bollone uncovered in the Holy Shroud of Turin).

In the Blood there were found proteins in the same normal proportions (percentage-wise) as are found in the sero-proteic make-up of the fresh normal blood.

In the Blood there were also found these minerals: chlorides, phosphorus, magnesium, potassium, sodium and calcium.

The preservation of the Flesh and of the Blood, which were left in their natural state for twelve centuries and exposed to the action of atmospheric and biological agents, remains an extraordinary phenomenon.


21 posted on 02/24/2011 4:15:36 PM PST by ADSUM (Democracy works when citizens get involved and keep government honest.)
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To: ADSUM
I'm not sure whether miracles are revelations or reinforcement, but I have no doubt they are real. I really feel sorry for those whose faiths are so void of miracles. It does not speak of an absence of God, only an absence of faith.
22 posted on 02/24/2011 4:39:15 PM PST by Natural Law
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To: Natural Law
Bible


"We are compelled to concede to the Papists
that they have the Word of God,
that we received it from them,
and that without them
we should have no knowledge of it at all."

~ Martin Luther



Is the Bible the Only Revelation from God? (Catholic / Orthodox Caucus)
Did Martin Luther Act Infallibly in Defining What Books Belong in the Bible?
History of the Bible (caution: long)
Catholic and Protestant Bibles
THE CATHOLIC CHURCH: ON READING THE BIBLE [Catholic Caucus]

Because I Love the Bible
Where Is That Taught in the Bible?
When Was the Bible Really Written?
Three Reasons for Teaching the Bible [St. Thomas Aquinas]
The Smiting Is Still Implied (God of the OT vs the NT)
Where Is That Taught in the Bible?
Friday Fast Fact: The Bible in English
Bible Reading is Central in Conversions to Catholicism in Shangai, Reports Organization
Verses (in Scripture) I Never Saw
5 Myths about 7 Books

Lectionary Statistics - How much of the Bible is included in the Lectionary for Mass? (Popquiz!)
Pope calls Catholics to daily meditation on the Bible
What Are the "Apocrypha?"
The Accuracy of Scripture
US Conference of Catholic Bishops recommendations for Bible study
CNA unveils resource to help Catholics understand the Scriptures
The Dos and Don’ts of Reading the Bible [Ecumenical]
Pope to lead marathon Bible reading on Italian TV
The Complete Bible: Why Catholics Have Seven More Books [Ecumenical]
Beginning Catholic: Books of the Catholic Bible: The Complete Scriptures [Ecumenical]

Beginning Catholic: When Was The Bible Written? [Ecumenical]
The Complete Bible: Why Catholics Have Seven More Books [Ecumenical]
U.S. among most Bible-literate nations: poll
Bible Lovers Not Defined by Denomination, Politics
Dei Verbum (Catholics and the Bible)
Vatican Offers Rich Online Source of Bible Commentary
Clergy Congregation Takes Bible Online
Knowing Mary Through the Bible: Mary's Last Words
A Bible Teaser For You... (for everyone :-)
Knowing Mary Through the Bible: New Wine, New Eve

Return of Devil's Bible to Prague draws crowds
Doctrinal Concordance of the Bible [What Catholics Believe from the Bible] Catholic Caucus
Should We Take the Bible Literally or Figuratively?
Glimpsing Words, Practices, or Beliefs Unique to Catholicism [Bible Trivia]
Catholic and Protestant Bibles: What is the Difference?
Church and the Bible(Caatholic Caucus)
Pope Urges Prayerful Reading of Bible
Catholic Caucus: It's the Church's Bible
How Tradition Gave Us the Bible
The Church or the Bible

23 posted on 02/24/2011 4:41:58 PM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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Comment #24 Removed by Moderator

Comment #25 Removed by Moderator

To: Salvation; Religion Moderator
Did Martin Luther Act Infallibly in Defining What Books Belong in the Bible?

Is it safe to assume the glass has been broken?

26 posted on 02/24/2011 7:28:16 PM PST by Gamecock (The resurrection of Jesus Christ is both historically credible and existentially satisfying. T.K.)
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To: Religion Moderator; Salvation

What was the reason for Salvation’s post #23 being removed?


27 posted on 02/25/2011 5:00:51 PM PST by Natural Law
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To: Natural Law
Post 23 was removed because it mentioned Martin Luther which would be a non-member to the original caucus tag.

However, the caucus tag was removed altogether because the thread is involved in a "flame war by article." Therefore, I will restore 23.

A similar "flame war by article" happened years ago when posters on both sides were posting sex scandal articles.

The solution will be similar, caucus threads that appear frivolous or part of the flame war will either be pulled or the caucus tag removed.

28 posted on 02/25/2011 7:31:59 PM PST by Religion Moderator
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To: Religion Moderator; Natural Law

So if I were to take the part about Luther off — then it could be a Catholic/Orthodox Caucus?

Is that what you are saying?

It’s all about the Catholic Bible — even Luther’s statement, so I don’t quite understand why it would be objectionable.


29 posted on 02/25/2011 8:18:27 PM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Salvation

It’s too late for this thread to be redeemed but if you post the list on a Catholic/Orthodox Caucus be sure to leave the infallibility of Luther out of it.


30 posted on 02/25/2011 8:25:17 PM PST by Religion Moderator
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To: Religion Moderator
"However, the caucus tag was removed altogether because the thread is involved in a "flame war by article."

The Sola Scriptura caucus tag has not been removed from the same original article.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/2678416/posts

I initiated a Catholic Caucus thread for the article so that Catholics could discuss the article inclusive of Tradition and Apparitions. I trust the lack of fairness and balance was an oversight on your part.

31 posted on 02/25/2011 8:32:31 PM PST by Natural Law
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Comment #32 Removed by Moderator

To: Natural Law
I initiated a Catholic Caucus thread for the article so that Catholics could discuss the article inclusive of Tradition and Apparitions. I trust the lack of fairness and balance was an oversight on your part.

The other one wasn't posted by Catholics, so its ok.

33 posted on 02/25/2011 8:37:41 PM PST by Titanites
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Comment #34 Removed by Moderator

Comment #35 Removed by Moderator

To: Natural Law

And a cokehead!


36 posted on 02/25/2011 8:46:24 PM PST by narses ( 'Prefer nothing to the love of Christ.')
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To: Religion Moderator
"It’s too late for this thread to be redeemed but if you post the list on a Catholic/Orthodox Caucus be sure to leave the infallibility of Luther out of it."

For the record are references to Doctors of the Church like St. Augustine, St. Thomas Aquinas, St. Francis de Sales, and similar pre-reformation figures prohibited in non Catholic caucuses?

37 posted on 02/25/2011 8:57:31 PM PST by Natural Law
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To: Natural Law
Yes, for the same reason Moses can be quoted in these caucuses: Jewish/Noachide, Catholic/Orthodox, LDS, Sola Scriptura, Dispensational, Non-denominational.

However, the caucus cannot be used as cover to attack the beliefs of non-members.

38 posted on 02/25/2011 9:33:12 PM PST by Religion Moderator
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To: Religion Moderator
"However, the caucus cannot be used as cover to attack the beliefs of non-members."

This is extremely confusing subject, particularly in light of the seemingly arbitrary definitions and guidelines and the inconsistency of enforcement. Please help to clarify a few questions:

Where does the exclusion of non-members from the discussion of nondenominal issues and general news stories fall in terms of attacking belief and attacking because of beliefs?

Are discussions of Luther's origins as a Catholic clergy and his deathbed wishes to reestablish Communion with the Church off limits in Catholic Caucuses?

39 posted on 02/25/2011 10:01:12 PM PST by Natural Law
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To: Natural Law
At the moment there is a flame war being conducted by posting frivolous caucus articles. When ANY moderator determines the caucus is not legit, he will remove the caucus tag or pull the thread altogether.

Where does the exclusion of non-members from the discussion of nondenominal issues and general news stories fall in terms of attacking belief and attacking because of beliefs?

"Non-denominational" is a caucus which includes Non-Denominational Churches and Independent Baptists. Mentioning their beliefs would be inappropriate on for instance, a "Catholic Caucus."

General news stories or subjects which are not theological per se (philosophy, science, culture, archeology, etc.) may be appropriate for a caucus - e.g. the "Dispensational Caucus" often discusses prophecy v. current events.

If we were not in the middle of a "flame war by article" non-theological items would usually be legitimate for a caucus. At the moment, if they appear to be part of a flame war, they will be pulled.

Are discussions of Luther's origins as a Catholic clergy and his deathbed wishes to reestablish Communion with the Church off limits in Catholic Caucuses?

Non-caucus members would have an interest in the discussion of Luther's beliefs and so the caucus thread should be opened for such a discussion.
40 posted on 02/25/2011 10:15:09 PM PST by Religion Moderator
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To: Religion Moderator; Salvation; Natural Law
Therefore, I will restore 23.

Post #23 still hasn't been restored.

41 posted on 03/05/2011 4:45:06 AM PST by Titanites
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