Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

To: Natural Law

I am not sure what is meant by Calvinists and the Christian Bible, i have read several different versions and they pretty much bring the same message, except a word changed here and there in the new Bibles for the purpose of changing a whole concept of the meaning.

I read the K.J.V. because it is easier for me to get my own idea of the meaning, for instance if one word is changed it can make the surrounding scripture seem useless.

The Christian Bible? which one are we talking about? the one i read plainly says faith with out works is dead and it also says the works of the law can not save us.

We are saved by his grace through faith as were the apostles, most of them gave their lives for Christ.

How many our fathers or hail marys does it take to be saved? how many amens do you have to do to be saved?

I think we either have to live for Christ or die for him to be saved, those who live for him would not pass up some one in need of help and proceed on their way to church.

They would not get on a jury and judge some one else to death for something they may have done themselves.

They certainly would not scorn some one for drinking wine or smoking a cigarette.

So it seems to me there are very few people who are living for Christ, but God knows our hearts and he knows what we need.

Remember,? he said many shall be called, but few will be chosen, he also said that he will raise the believers at the last day, not before tribulations, if we are his we most likely will die at the hands of the end time beast.

Revelation 6:9-11 (King James Version)

9
And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:

10
And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?

11
And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

matt 16
24
Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.
25
For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it.
26
For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?
27
For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.

Are we the brethren that they are waiting for?


69 posted on 02/28/2011 6:17:25 AM PST by ravenwolf (Just a bit of the long list of proofs)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]


To: ravenwolf
no one says we can work out our salvation without God's grace.

our salvation is from Christ's sacrifice only. It is God's grace that saves us, we cannot save ourselves, that is Church teaching since Apostolic times.

Our works are just following God's words to "If any man would come after me, let him deny himself and take up his cross and follow me" (Mt 16:24) and our works are our following scripture which tells us that we must work out our own salvation (which does not mean we can save ourselves, yet points out that we can lose the freely granted grace of Salvation that Jesus Christ gave us by His sacrifice on the Cross)

The Church has always taught that we are saved by God's grace -- that is the initial grace that allows us to accept His salvation.

Yet scripture says that we must work out our own salvation and we know from Ezekiel 33:12-16 that we can lose our salvation

So let's put it together -- Christ's sacrifice is what saves us. We must accept this salvation. Yet we can lose it (Eze 33) and scripture tells us to work out our own salvation and that salvation is not by faith alone. So that means we must work to accept this salvation provided by Christ

If we do just works and have no faith, we are not saved. If we do just works and do not accept the salvation of Christ, i.e. believe that Jesus Christ is Lord and God and Savior and died for us, we are not saved.

Our works cannot save us -- only Christ can save us -- that is Church teaching

The merit of man before God in the Christian life arises from the fact that God has freely chosen to associate man with the work of his grace. The fatherly action of God is first on his own initiative, and then follows man's free acting through his collaboration, so that the merit of good works is to be attributed in the first place to the grace of God, then to the faithful. Man's merit, moreover, itself is due to God, for his good actions proceed in Christ, from the predispositions and assistance given by the Holy Spirit. The Catechism confirms this as

Justification has been merited for us by the Passion of Christ who offered himself on the cross as a living victim, holy and pleasing to God, and whose blood has become the instrument of atonement for the sins of all men.

Our justification comes from the grace of God. Grace is favor, the free and undeserved help that God gives us to respond to his call to become children of God, adoptive sons, partakers of the divine nature and of eternal life.

This vocation to eternal life is supernatural. It depends entirely on God's gratuitous initiative, for he alone can reveal and give himself. It surpasses the power of human intellect and will, as that of every other creature.

The preparation of man for the reception of grace is already a work of grace. This latter is needed to arouse and sustain our collaboration in justification through faith, and in sanctification through charity. God brings to completion in us what he has begun, "since he who completes his work by cooperating with our will began by working so that we might will it:

Grace is first and foremost the gift of the Spirit who justifies and sanctifies us. But grace also includes the gifts that the Spirit grants us to associate us with his work, to enable us to collaborate in the salvation of others and in the growth of the Body of Christ, the Church. There are sacramental graces, gifts proper to the different sacraments. There are furthermore special graces, also called charisms after the Greek term used by St. Paul and meaning "favor," "gratuitous gift," "benefit."53 Whatever their character - sometimes it is extraordinary, such as the gift of miracles or of tongues - charisms are oriented toward sanctifying grace and are intended for the common good of the Church. They are at the service of charity which builds up the Church

Since it belongs to the supernatural order, grace escapes our experience and cannot be known except by faith.

"If any man would come after me, let him deny himself and take up his cross and follow me" (Mt 16:24).

73 posted on 02/28/2011 6:31:20 AM PST by Cronos ("They object to tradition saying that they themselves are wiser than the apostles" - Ire.III.2.2)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 69 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson