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To: HarleyD
If the bread does not change, then could you explain what exactly is the "substance" that becomes the body of Christ?

But, the bread does change, entirely. It ceases to be bread and becomes the Body of Christ. When we speak of substance we are talking about what a thing truly is. It looks, tastes, smell, and reacts just like bread, but it isn't bread because God has made it otherwise. Should we believe that God is subject to laws of matter, or the other way around? Should we believe that only material things are real, and suggest that unless material things are involved they are not real? Does the Father have a material body? Is he not real then?

Physical properties are not more real than the underlying substance. Just because we can see them and touch them some people equate that to reality, and yet it is not so. We all die physically, and yet we do not die spiritually. Is the physical death real and the spiritual life false? No, the opposite is closer to the truth. Similarly, the substance of a thing is every bit as real as are the accidents, more so, and that is what changes in the Eucharist. There is no physical change whatsoever.

26 posted on 04/22/2011 6:30:53 PM PDT by cothrige
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To: cothrige

So in other words the bread doesn’t change but it does change???? Where exactly is the evidence? Doesn’t this sound the least strange? How can you know this is true? Because someone who doesn’t know any more than you told you it to be so?

As far as physical/spiritual goes, people have reportedly seen ghosts, etc as far back as Samuel. I don’t wish to get into a discussion of this but there are dimensions that people have experienced and have been scientifically captured.

But to say the bread has changed when there is absolutely no evidence is like trying to convince an emperor that nothing is really new clothes. But there are always some that buy into that.


34 posted on 04/24/2011 4:09:20 AM PDT by HarleyD
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