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To: Bed_Zeppelin
There is one scripture that has piqued my interest however, if someone would care to explain what it means...

“Now learn this parable from the fig tree: When its branch has already become tender and puts forth leaves, you know that summer is near. So you also, when you see all these things, know that it is near—at the doors! Assuredly, I say to you, this generation will by no means pass away till all these things take place.” Matt 24:32-34

Yah'shua is saying that we will know the season of His coming

The fig tree has always bee associated with Israel.

In Psalm 90 Moses states the length of a mans life as three score and ten.

Israel will 70 years old in 2018.

shalom b'SHEM Yah'shua HaMashiach
15 posted on 05/13/2011 8:27:25 AM PDT by Uri’el-2012 (Psalm 119:174 I long for Your salvation, YHvH, Your law is my delight.)
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To: UriÂ’el-2012

“But of that day and hour knoweth no [man], no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.” — Matthew 24:36


16 posted on 05/13/2011 8:48:19 AM PDT by Celtic Cross (Some minds are like cement; thoroughly mixed up and permanently set...)
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To: UriÂ’el-2012
There is one scripture that has piqued my interest however, if someone would care to explain what it means...

As well it should since your presuppositions are all wrong (OK, maybe not the Psalm 90 reference, but nonetheless, it is irrelevant)

Yah'shua is saying that we will know the season of His coming

The Kingdom is already here Luke 22:18 says that our LORD would not eat or drink with them until the Kingdom of God has come. In Acts 10:41 we read that soon after He rose from the dead, He ate and drank with the disciples.

The fig tree has always bee associated with Israel.

That is pure fiction generated by the Futurists, there are no passages in Scripture that associate the Fig Tree with the secular nation of Israel, ethnic Jews, or, for that matter any people or nation. Many ignorant people look at Matthew 24:32-34 and think that the Fig Tree is Israel because they want it to be and thus they eisegete that fantasy into the passage with absolutely zero support other than wishful thinking. Otherwise, please explain Luke 21:29-33 which says "Behold the fig tree, and all the other trees"

But if Futurists demand it based on some extra-biblical tradition or that it is mortal to their camp-fire story, then ask yourself this: "If the Fig Tree is Israel, then what do we make of the Curse against the Fig Tree whereupon God caused it to wither and die?" (Matthew 21:19) Because you have an even bigger problem with handling the death of Israel statement direct from God's mouth "Let no fruit grow on thee heceforward for ever." Naturally, the Futurists hate this passage and have ripped it from their Bibles since it kills the whole Fig = Israel = Grand Future theory.

Israel will 70 years old in 2018.

This is called "moving the field goal". The whole age of Israel foolishness was made largely to deal with the wresting of Mt 24:34 "this generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled." because Futurists want to be in on the action and can't possibly have anything really fulfilled before they were around to witness and experience it, "this generation" actually meant "that generation" and "generation" was transmogrified from the people standing before him, to a secular UN creation in the 20th century thousands of years from the "very soon" comment made by our LORD. A generation was always considered to be forty years, and thus every Dispensationalist/Futurist was pegging their Rapture on the date of the Jewish calendar's New Year using the Roman Catholic Gregorian calendar 1988 - naturally combining a traditional Jewish calendar with a calendar not yet in existence by over a millennia and a half at the time of the prediction (these are prime example of Futurist logic and interpretational hermeneutics.)

But if you talk to Tim LaHaye, author of the wildly popular "Left Behind" series and considered THE authority and pillar of the Futurist cabal, originally had the birth date of Israel back at the signing of the Balfour Declaration of 1917. Even with your "70 year" theory, that still places it at or around 1988 which as we all know was not the date of the alleged "rapture".

In Psalm 90 Moses states the length of a mans life as three score and ten.

I really can't imagine, other than the pathology of wanting to be "that generation" that experiences the alleged "Rapture" why this would matter in any context. First of all, didn't you just compare Israel to a tree? If so, then what does that have to do with the life span of a human? If you are trying to reckon the years for a generation, you are asking more out of the word than it can bare. Generally speaking, a "generation" is not a period of time as so much as it means "the people of this time". Let's say that our LORD meant forty years, since forty years is the magic number gratuitously assigned to redefine a generation by the Futurists. So when He said "this generation", what was year zero for that generation for when they start counting? In Futurist's parlance, clearly that stopwatch doesn't get flicked on to at least two thousand years later. And is it Balfour as LaHaye originally advocated or is it 1948 when younger people who want to be in on the action claim it to be?

If you want to do some synthesis to generate a more meaningful number, I'll give you "100" as the number of years in a generation based on Genesis 15:13,16. "they shall afflict them four hundred years"(13) followed by the divisor "in the fourth generation they shall come hither again". I do this as a public service and because I don't want you to walk away with the idea that all I want to do is shoot down theories - you have a new date to look forward to 2048.

So go forth and enjoy the life God gave you and put aside this foolish speculation about a fantasy Rapture. When our LORD returns, it won't be a U-Turn somewhere at cruising altitude for modern jet-craft, it will be to come and judge the Earth once and for all.

31 posted on 05/13/2011 5:59:57 PM PDT by The Theophilus (Obama's Key to win 2012: Ban Haloperidol)
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To: UriÂ’el-2012; Bed_Zeppelin; Matchett-PI
Israel will 70 years old in 2018.

Israel is not a man. Modern Israel is not biblical Israel. The two have little to do with each other.

The date-setters in the late 1970s like Hal Lindsey saw 1988 as the key year that Jesus would return (a “generation” in the Bible being 40 years). His prediction as wrong because his starting point for counting was wrong.

"I'm convinced that the Lord is coming for His Church before the end of 1981" (Chuck Smith, Future Survival)

"Since a generation of judgment is forty years and the Tribulation period lasts seven years, I believe the Lord could come back for His Church any time before the Tribulation starts, which would mean any time before 1981. (1948 + 40 - 7 = 1981)." (Hal Lindsey, The Late Great Planet Earth)

"88 Reasons Why The Rapture Could Be In 1988." -- Edgar Whisenant

Those who suggest 2018 are just as fraudulent in their ideas as the foolish ones that have gone before. What date will you give us in 2019?

Futurist Rogue's Gallery: Clockwise from the top left: John Hagee, Hal Lindsey, Tommy Ice, Charles Taze Russell, Joel C. Rosenberg, J.R. Church, Edgar C. Whisenant, J. Randall Price, Mark Hitchcock, Harold Camping, C.I. Scofield, Tim LaHaye/Jerry B. Jenkins, Grant Jeffrey, Jack Van Impe, William Miller.

44 posted on 05/15/2011 6:38:30 PM PDT by topcat54 ("Friends don't let friends listen to dispensationalists.")
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To: UriÂ’el-2012; Bed_Zeppelin; Matchett-PI
Biblical Israel vs. Modern Israel

Here are some characteristics of Biblical Israel that modern Israel does not share. The absence of these characteristics proves that modern Israel is in no sense related to Biblical Israel, therefore it cannot be a fulfillment of any biblical prophecies.

  1. Biblical Israel was established as part of the covenant made with Abraham and the promises made with the Seed, Jesus Christ. (Gen. 12:7; 13:15; 24:7; Gal. 3:16)
  2. Inclusion in Biblical Israel was by vow and obedience to God’s covenant, not strictly by lineage. (Gen. 17:23; Lev. 18:26; Rom. 2:28,29; 9:6,7)
  3. Biblical Israel was identified as a nation when they corporately vowed to abide by the law of God as given through Moses. (Exo. 19:8)
  4. Disobedience to the law of God was reason for individual excommunication from the nation of Israel, and temporal corporate punishment. (Exo. 12:15; Lev. 7:27; Lev. 18:29; Deut. 28:15)
  5. Biblical Israel was governed by God-ordained representatives in the church (the priesthood with respect to the ceremonial) and the state (elders, judges, and kings with respect to the civil) as a single and unique kingdom under God. (Lev. 13:2; Deut. 17:9; 19:12; 21:19)
  6. The judges of Biblical Israel was chosen directly by God. (Luke 22:30; James 1:1)
  7. Biblical Israel could have its nationhood status revoked through disobedience. (Matt. 21:43; John 11:48)
  8. The older covenant was never intended by God to be permanent, but was seen as giving way to a new covenant. (Jer. 31:31; Matt. 26:28; Heb. 8:13; 9:15; 12:24)
  9. For Biblical Israel the law was seen as a tutor to lead them Christ, not as a means of salvation. (Matt. 23:23; Luke 24:44; Rom. 3:20; Gal. 3:24)
  10. Faith and repentance always preceded Biblical Israel’s physical restoration and blessing. (1 Kings 8:47,48; Ezra 1:5; Jer. 27:22)
  11. Restoration is clearly seen as an act of divine intervention, even by the nations. (Ezra 1:1; Ezekiel 37:28)
  12. Restoration is predicated on spiritual rebirth. (Ezekiel 36:26-28; 37:14)
  13. Faithfulness to God in our day is measured by a proper relationship to the new covenant, not to rabbinic traditions. (Matt. 5:20; 16:6; Luke 1:72; Rom. 11:27; 2 Cor. 3:6)
  14. Modern Israel does not inhabit the land of promise. (Gen. 15:13)
  15. Modern Israel is not apportioned according to God's direction (Num. 33:54; Joshua 1:6; 13:7)
  16. Modern Israel is a large debtor nation. The ratio of public debt to GDP is higher in Israel than in the US. Biblical Israel was to lend to others. (Deut. 15:6)

45 posted on 05/15/2011 6:45:44 PM PDT by topcat54 ("Friends don't let friends listen to dispensationalists.")
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