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To: rzman21; Iscool; daniel1212
Faith and reason come from the same place. At least Catholic priests aren’t anti-intellectuals like yourself.

Maybe you might be happy with the Taliban.

Oh, the irony......

►VEHEMENTER NOS, Encyclical of Pope Pius X promulgated on February 11, 1906:

It follows that the Church is essentially an unequal society, that is, a society comprising two categories of per sons, the Pastors and the flock, those who occupy a rank in the different degrees of the hierarchy and the multitude of the faithful. So distinct are these categories that with the pastoral body only rests the necessary right and authority for promoting the end of the society and directing all its members towards that end; the one duty of the multitude is to allow themselves to be led, and, like a docile flock, to follow the Pastor

http://baltimore-catechism.com/lesson12.htm:

Q. 554. Could a person who denies only one article of our faith be a Catholic?

A. A person who denies even one article of our faith could not be a Catholic; for truth is one and we must accept it whole and entire or not at all.

►“Once he does so (joins the Catholic church), he has no further use for his reason. He enters the Church, an edifice illumined by the superior light of revelation and faith. He can leave reason like a lantern at the door.” (John H. Stapleton, Explanation of Catholic Morals, Chapter XIX, XXIII. the consistent believer (1904); Nihil Obstat. Remy Lafort, Censor Librorum. Imprimatur, John M. Farley, Archbishop of New York )

►“All that we do [as must be patent enough now] is to submit our judgment and conform our beliefs to the authority Almighty God has set up on earth to teach us; this, and nothing else.”

“...outside the pale of Rome there is not a scrap of additional truth of Revelation to be found.”

“He willingly submits his judgment on questions the most momentous that can occupy the mind of man-----questions of religion-----to an authority located in Rome.”

“Absolute, immediate, and unfaltering submission to the teaching of God's Church on matters of faith and morals-----this is what all must give..”

“The Vicar of Christ is the Vicar of God; to us the voice of the Pope is the voice of God. This, too, is why Catholics would never dream of calling in question the utterance of a priest in expounding Christian doctrine according to the teaching of the Church;” “He is as sure of a truth when declared by the Catholic Church as he would be if he saw Jesus Christ standing before him and heard Him declaring it with His Own Divine lips.” - “Henry G. Graham, "What Faith Really Means", (Nihil Obstat:C. SCHUT, S. T.D., Censor Deputatus, Imprimatur: EDM. CANONICUS SURMONT, D.D.,Vicarius Generalis. WESTMONASTERII, Die 30 Septembris, 1914 )

Obey blindly , that is, without asking reasons. Be careful, then, never to examine the directions of your confessor....In a word, keep before your eyes this great rule, that in obeying your confessor you obey God. Force yourself then, to obey him in spite of all fears. And be persuaded that if you are not obedient to him it will be impossible for you to go on well; but if you obey him you are secure. But you say, if I am damned in consequence of obeying my confessor, who will rescue me from hell? What you say is impossible." St. Alphonsus De Liguori, True Spouse of Christ, p 352, Benziger Brothers, NY

►PRAECLARA GRATULATIONIS PUBLICAE, Apostolic Letter of Pope Leo XIII, June 20, 1894

But since We hold upon this earth the place of God Almighty, Who will have all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the Truth, and now that Our advanced age and the bitterness of anxious cares urge Us on towards the end common to every mortal, We feel drawn to follow the example of Our Redeemer and Master, Jesus Christ..

http://www.papalencyclicals.net/Leo13/l13praec.htm

The leadership of the Apostolic See has always been active, and therefore because of its preeminent authority , the whole Church must agree with it." (On Faith And Religion), Encyclical promulgated on November 9, 1846, #11. http://www.papalencyclicals.net/Pius09/p9quiplu.htm

►"These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so." (Acts 17:11)

*Partial list of references to Divine written revelation being written (Scripture) and references to it, substantiating the claim that as they were written, the written word became the standard for obedience and in establishing truth claims

672 posted on 11/27/2011 6:34:44 AM PST by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: metmom
That's why they can not discuss the scriptures...They are puppets...Everything is scripted...When we go outside of their script with scripture, they are completely lost...

They have no response...They don't know any response...So the insults fly to deflect their complete lack of biblical knowledge...

707 posted on 11/27/2011 7:44:22 AM PST by Iscool (You mess with me, you mess with the WHOLE trailerpark...)
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To: metmom
That's why they can not discuss the scriptures...They are puppets...Everything is scripted...When we go outside of their script with scripture, they are completely lost...

They have no response...They don't know any response...So the insults fly to deflect their complete lack of biblical knowledge...

708 posted on 11/27/2011 7:44:35 AM PST by Iscool (You mess with me, you mess with the WHOLE trailerpark...)
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To: metmom
"Oh the irony..."

This is the most dishonest post in a very long line of dishonest posts from you. Although it attempts to cite its sources the entire post with typos and formatting was copied (stolen; plagiarized?) as it is clearly the work of others. Presenting stolen falsehoods and deceptions to prove you and your version of Christianity is superior is in deed ironic. This might pass for scholarship amongst the guests at George W. Hill but it doesn't in the honest world. Just when I thought it impossible to think less of you.........

VEHEMENTER NOS was written to address a law passed by a French leftist government in which the state had to approve the selection and retention of Bishops. You might not oppose the Obama administration selecting your clergy but actual Christians did and do object "vehemently".

Your link to the Baltimore Catechism does not work, proving even further your sloppy standards for scholarship. Even though, as we have discussed on many occasions, the Baltimore Catechism was a compendium produced for children with the purpose of INTRODUCING them to the faith the section your source snipped from addresses the four marks of the Church. These, from the Apostles Creed, are it is One, it is Holy, it is Catholic, and it is Apostolic. Question 554 is one of the proofs that it is One, because those who reject any article of faith have CHOSEN to not be in Communion.

Fr. Stapleton's Explanation of Catholic Morals - a Concise, REASONED, and Popular Exposiiton of Catholic Morals" is where your post is most damning of your efforts. The source you plagiarized from truncated the title since the full title is counter to the argument. The chapter the quote is from is not Chapter XXIII The Consistent Believer, it is from Chapter XIX Whence Our Belief: Reason. That chapter builds a reasoned case to put our trust in God and once we have followed that reason, and have faith in God, our own reason in matters of faith becomes unnecessary. It does not begin with that premise as your plagiarized source misrepresents.

I would suggest that you read the entire book, as you appear to be in dire need of it and to pay particular attention to chapters dealing with Contumely, Defamation, Detraction, Calumny, Mendacity, and Concealing the Truth.

Bishop Henry G. Graham, the Author of What Faith Really Means" is particularly galling to Presbyterians since he was a convert from the Church of Scotland and was the end of an unbroken family tradition of clergy in the Church of Scotland that had lasted over 200 years. Since its publication in 1910 it has been ridiculed and quoted out of context. The 90 page book is available on line and is largely an appeal to, as Bishop Graham puts it, "our separated brethren".

To portray St. Alphonsus De Liguori's True Spouse of Christ as a teaching for all catholics is one of your bigger whoppers. It is a book intended for nuns in training. LOL.....BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAH

Lastly, there is nothing really damning cited from PRAECLARA GRATULATIONIS PUBLICAE except what is not mentioned, its context. It is an encyclical that addresses the heresy of Modernism and calls upon all Catholics to reject it. We all know how you embrace heresy so your finding fault with this encyclical is no surprise.

713 posted on 11/27/2011 8:51:56 AM PST by Natural Law (If you love the Catholic Church raise your hands, if not raise your standards.)
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