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Thief on the Cross - Heaven Bound or Purgatory Bound
Bible | 2011 | BibleTruth

Posted on 12/23/2011 8:28:19 PM PST by bibletruth

Was the thief in Luke 23 heaven (paradise) bound or purgatory bound?

Luke 23:41: And we indeed justly; for we receive the due reward of our deeds: but this man hath done nothing amiss. Luke 23:42: And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom. Luke 23:43: And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.


TOPICS: Apologetics; Mainline Protestant; Religion & Culture; Theology
KEYWORDS: grace; heaven; hellpurgatory; yopios
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Was the thief in Luke 23 heaven (paradise) bound or purgatory bound?

Luke 23:41: And we indeed justly; for we receive the due reward of our deeds: but this man hath done nothing amiss. Luke 23:42: And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom. Luke 23:43: And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.

And Jesus said...To day shalt thou be with me in paradise. This is significant, since the inspired Word of God, not of men, calls this man a thief, and it was his own testimony to the other thief on a cross that "we indeed justly; for we receive the due reward of our deeds: but this man hath done nothing amiss". That thief was admitting he had not been misjudged, but had indeed committed crimes worthy of the death penalty. If there was a purgatory, then this man would have gone directly to such a place, because a crime worthy of the death penalty - even by today's standards - would be a certain purgatory destination for such sins of such a one who believed in Jesus Christ, as this man indeed did. Do we see the Lord Jesus Christ Words say - "you shalt go to purgatory for your due reward - nay, on the contrary, we see hear the Lord Jesus Christ Words say - Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.

Since the Corinthians were very carnal, and if a purgatory did exist, it certainly would be their destination. Yet our Apostle Paul said to even these sinful believers that they can be confident that to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord.

II Corinthians 5:8: We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

We see that as believers we are confident and willing rather to be absent from the body in order to be present immediately with the Lord, just as the thief on the cross was.

Oh, but you say, that Christ absolved the thief on the cross, that's why the thief did not go to purgatory. Well if that's the case, why doesn't the Pope simply absolve all believers sins so that no one must go to purgatory! The LORD has already absolved all my sins - why cannot the Pope absolve sins so that no one must go to purgatory?

Rather, God's Word teaches us that Christ Jesus "by Himself purged our sins" without any help from man [Hebrews 1:3]; and that from II Corinthians 5:8, we are confident to be present with the Lord. Christ Jesus only spoke about heaven and hell, never purgatory. Christ Jesus never warned anyone about purgatory. He came to save sinners, not condemn them to purgatory to pay with their own sufferings for their own sins. Christ paid for all sins, past, present, and future!

II Peter 1:9: But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.

These clear teachings are in stark contrast with the existence of purgatory.

Oh, but what do we read in Matthew 5:26 … till thou hast paid the uttermost farthing… The context of Matthew 5:25-26 is NOT talking about salvation, but rather the context is about conduct with an adversary:

Matthew 5:25: Agree with thine adversary quickly, whiles thou art in the way with him; lest at any time the adversary deliver thee to the judge, and the judge deliver thee to the officer, and thou be cast into prison. Matthew 5:26: Verily I say unto thee, Thou shalt by no means come out thence, till thou hast paid the uttermost farthing. - THIS IS NOT purgatory - wrong context! Christ Jesus never mentions purgatory here - this is a warning on conduct and judgment regarding hell, not purgatory. Any honest commentary can clarify this.

A reckoning Christian would clearly see that Christ Jesus only warns us about Hell, and speaks only about the abode of heaven for believers, so a reckoning Christian would agree with God's Word that the thief was simply forgiven his sins and did indeed go to paradise; and in the same manner today, Christ Jesus has forgiven us all our sins and we indeed to directly to heaven.

Since in Ephesians 1:3: Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ: we now all have (possess) these heavenly blessings, how would a mercifully God send His blessed saints to purgatory to burn with fire and torments? God's clear teachings are in stark contrast with the existence of purgatory!

1 posted on 12/23/2011 8:28:31 PM PST by bibletruth
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To: bibletruth

I’ve always been taught that the Paradise mentioned was a waiting place for all the people of the Old Testament who would eventually enter heaven AFTER Christ.

Thus, the good thief went there — not to heaven, not to Purgatory, to the waiting place.

One of the Gospels talks about the spirits arising from their graves and roaming around Jerusalem only to be seen by the believers. They also were waiting to enter heaven AFTER the Resurrection when Jesus entered heaven.

I know some people may not agree with me, but that’s what I’ve been taught.


2 posted on 12/23/2011 8:40:05 PM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: bibletruth

Good post. In the end we don’t really know (referring to another poster’s “waiting place”), but I agree with your assessment that purgatory doesn’t seem “real”.


3 posted on 12/23/2011 8:45:58 PM PST by TheZMan (http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2794639/posts)
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To: bibletruth
Do we see the Lord Jesus Christ Words say - "you shalt go to purgatory for your due reward - nay, on the contrary, we see hear the Lord Jesus Christ Words say - Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.

I've long contended that the Catholic "purgatory" is a survival of the Hebrew Sheol. Heaven and Hell overlaid upon this conception don't quite square with what we understand, having both a paradaisical, even almost heavenly level or compartment that was actually referred to as "paradise," on down to the darkest depths of Sheol, outer darkness, a place of punishment.

However, Catholics also believe as do most Christians that the righteous dead were freed from Sheol by Jesus Christ, who led them out during the three days between crucifixion and resurrection. Whether "paradise" ceased to exist at that point or just no longer applies is not addressed at any length, and so most remain somewhat vague upon the whole thing.

So, even though I don't accept purgatory myself, as it's clear enough from scripture that such a place no longer applies to us if it ever did, I do recognize what was being said by Jesus Christ to the thief on the cross. He did see him that day in "paradise." It was Sheol, and He led them out, including the thief.

4 posted on 12/23/2011 8:46:55 PM PST by RegulatorCountry
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To: TheZMan

He had Jesus’s forgiveness—as the Christ said—he made it into Heaven. He realized Christ was innocent—he had done nothing wrong. He got it.


5 posted on 12/23/2011 8:47:48 PM PST by Forward the Light Brigade (Into the Jaws of H*ll)
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To: bibletruth; Salvation

Reading all comments with interest.


6 posted on 12/23/2011 8:49:27 PM PST by Ciexyz
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To: bibletruth; Admin Moderator
Isn't this a springtime kind of thread? Easter and all of that?

I thought we were celebrating the birth of Christ this time of year.

In fact, I am. Not appropriately, mind you, but there are not many admin moderators in real life, and the Christmas fake deer across the street can be arranged in.... interesting positions. Police will be called, photos will be taken....

I'll disclaim all knowledge. Everything will be fine, except for some blood pressure.

Admind mod... only pinged you because I mentioned you (or someone like you) as an aside. I'm pure as driven snow.

/johnny

7 posted on 12/23/2011 8:49:46 PM PST by JRandomFreeper (gone Galt)
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To: bibletruth

Merry Christmas.


8 posted on 12/23/2011 8:50:03 PM PST by Celtic Cross (The brain is the weapon; everything else is just accessories. --FReeper Joe Brower)
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To: bibletruth

Two questions come to mind immdeiately:

1. Since the the Greek didn’t have a comma here, how does a person decide where to put it?

2. Would the faithful before Christ made his sacrifice be bound for heaven?


9 posted on 12/23/2011 8:56:29 PM PST by count-your-change (You don't have to be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
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To: count-your-change
Since the the Greek didn’t have a comma here, how does a person decide where to put it?

And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee today, thou shalt be with me in paradise.

10 posted on 12/23/2011 9:01:33 PM PST by Ronaldus Magnus
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To: JRandomFreeper
Anytime is a good time to remind people of the truth of heaven and hell - for Jesus Christ came into this world to save sinners:

Isaiah 7:14 Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanual.

Christ came to save sinners from hell, and offer heaven. Some try to distort the truths regarding heaven and hell with un-biblival purgatory. Since Christ has come, we must remind people of the salvation from hell and the glorious grace salvation in heaven - purgatory robs people of that truth.

11 posted on 12/23/2011 9:03:36 PM PST by bibletruth
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To: count-your-change

The faithful before Christ’s sacrifice were placed into the center of the earth known as Sheol and in OT, in the NT it is Paradise. When Christ promised the thief on the cross, He knew He would rise from among dead ones after 3-24-hour days and 3-24-hour nights - He then went down to Paradise to release the saints in Sheol / Paradise and took them all up to heaven, which is where they reside today, awaiting the rapture / catching up of the saints.


12 posted on 12/23/2011 9:10:22 PM PST by bibletruth
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To: bibletruth
So, on this Advent day.... The day or two before Christmas... Preach this sinner a sermon about the Birth of Christ.

We'll work on resurrection and redemption in April. This is December.

/johnny

13 posted on 12/23/2011 9:14:17 PM PST by JRandomFreeper (gone Galt)
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To: Salvation

I want to clarify something here — that Paradise that Christ talked about could be what the Church later defined as Purgatory.

I’m not a theologian, but it occurred to me that I might be mistaken there.


14 posted on 12/23/2011 9:16:30 PM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Salvation

Actually, Purgatory is a waiting place of sorts. People who find themselves there know they are heaven bound, they are just being purified for the reparations they did not do on earth. It’s their actions, not Christ’s.

But they mnust be pure before they enter heaven.


15 posted on 12/23/2011 9:18:22 PM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: bibletruth
Tell me the story of Jesus.

Write on my heart, every word.

But do please start at the beginning.

/johnny

16 posted on 12/23/2011 9:19:19 PM PST by JRandomFreeper (gone Galt)
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To: JRandomFreeper
The day or two before Christmas...do you have a problem with WHY Jesus came to be born on the earth!!! He came to save sinners like you and formerly me so that we have have eternal life in heaven and not die in our sins in hell.

The birth of Christ is for this purpose ... He was born for the purpose to die on the cross in April in order to save sinners from hell.

Are you ashamed of the purpose of His birth for the purpose of the cross? The purpose of the resurrection and redemption was the ONLY reason He was born on this earth. Do not minimize this fact.

17 posted on 12/23/2011 9:25:22 PM PST by bibletruth
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To: Salvation

Purgatory was not a waiting place - Paradise served this purpose before Christ Jesus came into the world. Then Christ Jesus teaches us about heaven and hell, no more purgatory anymore...it never existed in the Bible


18 posted on 12/23/2011 9:27:41 PM PST by bibletruth
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To: count-your-change

1. Understanding the greek and the context of the greek wording. You can ask the same question about every language in the bible and you can even ask that about inserting the vowels in the Hebrew translation. Context.

2. Of course. The story Jesus told of the rich man and Lazarus was real (given every story with proper names is taken as a real event). In this story it describes the afterlife and two sections of it, one side “Abrahams Bosom” and another side with heat and flames separated by an impassable gap. WHen Jesus triumphed over sin and death and then held the keys to hell and death, He took those OT saints waiting in Abraham’s Bosom and brought them to Heaven.


19 posted on 12/23/2011 9:28:20 PM PST by Secret Agent Man (I'd like to tell you, but then I'd have to kill you.)
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To: JRandomFreeper

Jesus Christ was NOT born December 25.

Jesus was born earlier, in the fall, during the festival of Sukkoth, “the Feast of Tabernacles.” John 1:14 tells us that the Word became flesh and “dwelt” among us. The Hebrew word for dwell is shakan and means “tabernacle”. By inserting the proper wording, the scripture now reads, “The Word became flesh and Tabernacled among us” (Exodus 29:45).

Christ Jesus was 33½ years old at the time of his death. He began His ministry at age 30 (Luke 3:23) lasting for 3½ years. His baptism by John the Baptist came several months prior to the first Passover of His ministry (John 1:33-34, John 2:13, John 2:23). In John 4:35, Christ Jesus mentions that the harvest was four months away. Therefore, at this time, He is coming up to the second Passover as the harvest happens at about the same time as Passover. John 6:4 mentions another Passover, the third, followed by Tabernacles and the Dedication. The final, fourth, Passover is mentioned in John 11:55. Using this chronological information, it appears that Christ’s ministry lasted around 3½ years. He was crucified at Pesach (John 19:13-15) which occurs in the spring. Dialing back six months puts us into early fall which is when Sukkoth is marked in late September to early October, depending on the lunar cycle.


20 posted on 12/23/2011 9:32:51 PM PST by bibletruth
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To: Salvation

It’s a nice idea with no scriptural support that I’ve ever seen, that Christians have a second chance after death.

As I mentioned, your concept of Purgatory has clear roots in the Hebrew Sheol and appears to me to have been a survival of it. But, looking at every scriptural reference to the Crucifixion and Resurrection of Jesus Christ, as well as the New Testament scriptures referencing spiritual matters pertaining to the circumstance of believers as well as nonbelievers after physical death, it is clear that such a place no longer exists for Christians and most likely ceased to apply at all after Jesus Christ freed the righteous dead from Paradise, which was Old Testament as you mentioned.

Everything changed with the Resurrection. There is no longer any need to wait in a waiting place. Waiting for what? Not our Savior, He is risen. Purification, by fire is the belief, correct me if I’m mistaken, based upon one passage of scripture, the interpretation of which flies in the face of the rest of New Testament scripture, in order to support Purgatory.


21 posted on 12/23/2011 9:36:12 PM PST by RegulatorCountry
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To: bibletruth
I have no problem with why my Savior came to be born on earth. We had a close talk-talk about 2 years ago on the side of a mountain during a blizzard. We were good. I was washed in the blood. Literally.

I was actually disappointed that I'll have to go through the whole process again.

But there is the whole context appropriate thing that you are fundamentally missing.

And if Willie Nelson can figure it out, most idiots should be able to.

It's Christmas.

Everything in it's time. Time to sow, time to reap... even the old preacher understood that.

/johnny

22 posted on 12/23/2011 9:36:49 PM PST by JRandomFreeper (gone Galt)
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To: RegulatorCountry; bibletruth

sola scriptura is a nice idea with no scriptural support either.

Good night.


23 posted on 12/23/2011 9:38:46 PM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Salvation

“But they mnust be pure before they enter heaven.”

????? We aren’t pure and we cannot become pure but through Grace (ie, Christ). How does Purgatory change that?

Your post confuses me. Help?


24 posted on 12/23/2011 9:40:34 PM PST by piytar (The Obama Depression. Say it early, say it often. Why? Because it's TRUE.)
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To: Salvation

Scripture alone doesn’t support itself? Nonsensical.


25 posted on 12/23/2011 9:42:46 PM PST by RegulatorCountry
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To: bibletruth

Well that was an easy one, there’s no such thing as “purgatory.” Men are not allowed to make up things and if it ain’t in the Bible it ain’t nothing to worry about. Next question?


26 posted on 12/23/2011 9:43:59 PM PST by TPOOH (I wish I could have been Jerry Reed.)
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To: bibletruth
Jesus Christ was NOT born December 25.

I never said he was. But that is the standard date that Christians celebrate His birth on.

You seem angry for an envoy of Christ.

/johnny

27 posted on 12/23/2011 9:46:03 PM PST by JRandomFreeper (gone Galt)
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To: bibletruth
Heaven-bound.

Purgatory is not biblical, if you ask me (based on my studies of the bible.)

28 posted on 12/23/2011 9:46:45 PM PST by incindiary
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To: bibletruth
>There is plenty of information on the Internet about Purgatory as described by the Roman Catholic Church. There is also information in the Bible about Purgatory.
>Unfortunately, most Protestants have a ‘censored’ Bible. There is information available on the Internet about what was included in the Bible. Please ask yourself, ‘Where did this Bible come from?’
>Please read the four Gospels in your Bible. Hopefully, you'll notice Jesus Christ did NOT walk the Holy Lands handing out Bibles saying,’Here read this & argue about it.’ Jesus Christ established a Church & out of that Church came the Bible. Prayerfully, Christians should look for that Church instead of arguing about the ‘meaning’ of what's in the Bible.
>Anyone on Earth that thinks they are Perfect enough to stand before God should pray for discernment. Also, please remember forgiveness is conditional. The Lord's prayer,> ‘Forgive us our trespasses >as we< forgive those that trespass against us.
29 posted on 12/23/2011 9:49:30 PM PST by gghd
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To: JRandomFreeper

Wrong... I am not angry... I am only pointing out truth from the Bible to appreciate the salvation we have in Christ Jesus who saves us from hell by coming to this world first as a child to grow in God’s grace and for the purpose of offering Himself as a Redeemer. He was born in order to be that Redeemer, that is why I find the birth of Christ Jesus a precious mercy, because He come to save us as a Redeemer. That is the greater purpose for His birth.


30 posted on 12/23/2011 9:52:18 PM PST by bibletruth
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To: gghd

No need for vague hints about “censored” books, just lay it out for us, gghd.

Cite chapter and verse in support of Purgatory. I for one would appreciate seeing it, even if I don’t accept it.


31 posted on 12/23/2011 9:58:50 PM PST by RegulatorCountry
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To: bibletruth
You...

Got issues.

I laid, bleeding out on a mountian in a blizzard, and said to myself: "I'm alone"

And I got answered right back that no, I wasn't alone, Jesus was with me, had been with me, will be with me forever.

And then it was just the slog to get through the painful parts.

It's a celebration of the guy that verified my salvation on the side of the mountain, during a blizzard. With great special effects, I suppose, if it didn't hurt so badly. The whole sky clearing/moon rising thing was pretty, but I did pass out from blood loss about halfway through it.

Washed. Literally. In blood.

Come play on my mountain, and we'll talk. Docs gutted me like a fish.

Jesus and me... we are good.

/johnny

32 posted on 12/23/2011 10:01:37 PM PST by JRandomFreeper (gone Galt)
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To: gghd
Forgiveness is UN-conditional. That is Biblical for this Grace of God we have today. Believers today are completely and fully forgiven with no possibility of losing their salvation. Christ work on the cross is far superior to man's sins. The cross of Christ should NOT be of none affect or of vanity: God expects us to understand that there is NO ONE who condemns us today:

Romans 8:34: Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

Romans 8:35: Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?

Romans 8:38: For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,

Romans 8:39: Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

33 posted on 12/23/2011 10:02:03 PM PST by bibletruth
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To: bibletruth
You stir up stife, among the faithful.

I rebuke you.

/johnny

34 posted on 12/23/2011 10:09:04 PM PST by JRandomFreeper (gone Galt)
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To: JRandomFreeper

You stir up false witness against a faithful believer-saint, the Apostle Paul admonishes you.


35 posted on 12/23/2011 10:13:24 PM PST by bibletruth
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To: Secret Agent Man

Your comment about the story of The Rich Man and Lazarus intrigued me. I learn by asking questions, and I have a few to ask you.

There was a great chasm between the two sides described, and Abraham was on the “good side.” Why? The rich man was told he was on the “bad side” because he enjoyed the good things in life - wasn’t Abraham one of the richest men on earth when he was alive? With what crimes did Jesus charge the rich man? What evil had he committed? What good things did Lazarus do to command that we imitate him? I am reminded of David’s comment that “I have been young, and now am old; yet have I not seen the righteous forsaken, nor his seed begging bread. (Psa 37:25 KJV).

Furthermore, these dead guys had fingers, tongues, etc.?

The suffering on the “bad side” was audibly and visually apparent to those on the “good side?”

Again, I see nothing in what we are told of Lazarus that makes me want to emulate him. Also, I see nothing mentioned that condemns the rich man. I don’t think that being rich is a crime, do you? Apparently he allowed the beggar, Lazarus, to enjoy some of the “crumbs” from his table - otherwise why did Lazarus arrange to be dropped off there every day?

When Jesus talked about the rich and the poor, he wasn’t talking about money. I believe He was talking about those who were rich in power and prestige versus the common people.

Do you believe that Jesus could have been using a figure of speech called satire here? Remember who His audience consisted of - His most hated enemies, the Pharisees et al. I believe He was taking their teachings, carrying them out to all their logical conclusions, and then throwing everything back in their faces. Holding a doctrine or teaching up to ridicule is what I call satire, and this is what I believe Jesus was using here. What do you think?


36 posted on 12/23/2011 10:16:29 PM PST by Overwatcher
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To: bibletruth
Please reread your reply. It doesn't say anything about unconditional forgiveness. Please pray the Lord's prayer & ask for discernment when you say> ‘as we.’
37 posted on 12/23/2011 10:18:17 PM PST by gghd
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To: bibletruth
What false witness? You going to argue with the hand damage? Or the belly scar?

Or my personal revelation?

Take it to the Lord in Prayer.

I stand, redeemed in blood. Regardless of what you like. I was there. Every hateful moment of it. I was there.

How about focusing on the BIRTH of Christ. Since that's where we are in the year.

/johnny

38 posted on 12/23/2011 10:22:29 PM PST by JRandomFreeper (gone Galt)
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To: gghd
Forgiveness is UN-conditional:

Colossians 1:12: Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light:

Colossians 1:13: Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:

Colossians 1:14: In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:

In Colossians 1:14: In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins - we have is PAST TENSE not future tense. We who have faith in Christ Jesus have PAST TENSE redemption through His blood, even the forgiveness of sins - THIS IS UN-conditional. This make is impossible to be a conditional salvation, sorry, you need to read the Bible more carefully.

39 posted on 12/23/2011 10:24:05 PM PST by bibletruth
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To: Ronaldus Magnus

Finally, some one who agrees with me regarding the arbitrary placing of the comma. Since there was no punctuation in the Greek, we get to place the comma wherever we want.

Btw, do you believe there were three crucified or five? Could it have been two thieves, Jesus, and two malefactors, making a total of five with Jesus in the middle?


40 posted on 12/23/2011 10:24:19 PM PST by Overwatcher
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To: RegulatorCountry

In the Bible you may have> Please read 1 Corinthians 3: 11-15. There is plenty of information about Purgatory on the Web. Please ask yourself> Are you perfect right now? Is there any room for improvement in your spiritual walk with Christ? Are you> Perfect as Jesus Christ?


41 posted on 12/23/2011 10:27:34 PM PST by gghd
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To: JRandomFreeper
The purpose for the Christmas birth of Christ Jesus is well summarized in Galatians 4:4-5 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth His Son, made of a woman, made under the law, to redeem then that were under that law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.

That is a full summary of why God sent His Son. When we celebrate the birth of Jesus - we must need to celebrate that when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth His Son, made of a woman, made under the law, to redeem then that were under that law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.

People need to remember the greater purpose for why Jesus was born. It's much more than simply a baby in a manger - but Galatians 4:4-5 nails it down well for us to celebrate on in addition to His birth.

So what do you celebrate at Christmas - just a baby born in a manager, peace? Galatians 4:4-5 is the purpose for why we have a Christmas. God has made peace with us because His Son was born to go to that cross to make peace for us. The cross of Chris is everything - that is the express purpose of why He was born. That is what I celebrate at Christmas as a believer-saint in this Grace of His Grace according to His mighty power of His birth, life, and resurrection from the dead.

42 posted on 12/23/2011 10:30:34 PM PST by bibletruth
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To: TPOOH
Well that was an easy one, there’s no such thing as “purgatory.” Men are not allowed to make up things and if it ain’t in the Bible it ain’t nothing to worry about. Next question

where did the protestants come from...and why??????? they're about 1,500 years late to Christianity.

43 posted on 12/23/2011 10:31:16 PM PST by terycarl (lurking, but well informed)
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To: bibletruth

“Was the thief in Luke 23 heaven (paradise) bound or purgatory bound?”

Christ said “with me”.
Nothing else matters.


44 posted on 12/23/2011 10:32:34 PM PST by right way right (What's it gonna take?)
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To: bibletruth

I’m curious as to how you might reason this from the Scriptures.


45 posted on 12/23/2011 10:33:17 PM PST by count-your-change (You don't have to be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
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To: bibletruth

46 posted on 12/23/2011 10:34:38 PM PST by narses
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To: terycarl

You Catholics believe Christ died only for Catholics... Christ died and rose from the dead over 2,000 years ago for the un-conditional forgiveness of all sins for all people of ALL TIME, anyone at any time who has the faith of Christ and believes in His Redemption is declared a believer-saint.


47 posted on 12/23/2011 10:34:53 PM PST by bibletruth
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To: bibletruth; Religion Moderator; Admin Moderator
AM,RM, Nuke me if appropriate. Mayberequiredthanksbye.

You just don't get it, son. I think everyone here understands the redemption story. And it happens in APRIL.

This is DECEMBER.

Birthday. Or when we celebrate it, anyway. Promise of redemption. Joyful.

Sing the joyfull praises... and all of that.

Dude. You got issues.

But I got Jesus. That warm spot I found on the side of that mountain 2 years and 14 days ago.

I didn't deserve it. I didn't earn it.

It was a gift.

But I'm danged if I ever want to go at it that way, again.

/johnny

48 posted on 12/23/2011 10:44:11 PM PST by JRandomFreeper (gone Galt)
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To: bibletruth
Luke 23:43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.

thou be with me

Heavy emphasis on with me
Why would we even begin to think Jesus would be in purgatory ?
49 posted on 12/23/2011 10:46:36 PM PST by Lera
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To: bibletruth
My Bible: Colossians 1: 14 ‘in whom we have redmption, the forgiveness of sins.’ The deal is not sealed until you stand in the Particular Judgment. Please pray on the words >as we< in the Lord's prayer.
50 posted on 12/23/2011 10:50:40 PM PST by gghd
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