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To: madison10; rusty schucklefurd; The_Reader_David; Errant; bobo1; ExGeeEye; Secret Agent Man; ...

There are two distinct references to the resurrection of the dead.

1 Thess 4:13 But we do not want you to be uninformed, brethren, about those who are asleep, so that you will not grieve as do the rest who have no hope. 14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who have fallen asleep in Jesus. 15 For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord, will not precede those who have fallen asleep. 16 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.”

And again, a part of Revelation that is always ignored because of its simplicity and exact description, Revelation 20:4-6

4 “Then I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was given to them. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony of Jesus and because of the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received the mark on their forehead and on their hand; and they came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. 5 The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were completed. This is the first resurrection. 6 Blessed and holy is the one who has a part in the first resurrection; over these the second death has no power, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with Him for a thousand years.”

There is a sentence crucial to all. “THIS IS THE FIRST RESURRECTION.”

Therefore, the first resurrection occurs for those who have been martyred. “THE REST OF THE DEAD DID NOT COME TO LIFE UNTIL THE THOUSAND YEARS ARE COMPLETED.”

I believe the rapture occurs when God the Father calls all the saints at the end of this age, before He destroys this universe and then creates the New Heaven/Earth where we are for the rest of eternity.

Being a post-tribber for 40 years now I know that God can do miracles to save His remnant. Those who do live through the tribulation will suffer the natural calamities, drought and famine because it rains on the just and unjust so why not NO RAIN on the just and the unjust? However, the wrath of God will not be experienced by those who are righteous for God is just. Does everyone get the flu? Have faith and know that whether in life or death, He is in control. I also think the survivors will live hundreds of years longer than now, for things return to normal.

Many miracles occurred during the holocaust. It would be good to read about them again.

For those who died for their faith, there is the first resurrection. Serving the King of Kings and Lord of Lords during His victorious reign on earth. What a wonderful, wonderful time. Angels guarding the streets, resurrected righteous judges who cannot be bought, lions eating straw, etc., etc., are all tiny bits of the peace and joy and love that will be experienced. Use your imagination and go there for HOPE and faith, the hope and faith of Abraham.


55 posted on 01/14/2013 5:38:25 AM PST by huldah1776
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To: huldah1776
4 “Then I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was given to them. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony of Jesus and because of the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received the mark on their forehead and on their hand; and they came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. 5 The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were completed. This is the first resurrection. 6 Blessed and holy is the one who has a part in the first resurrection; over these the second death has no power, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with Him for a thousand years.”

There is much instruction encapsulated in the above verses. This is 'judgment day' for all. The good the bad and the independents.

Notice this 'tribulation' is not about flesh and blood, food and drink but about religion and those who willingly participate in the 'beast' system of religion. And not one word about a cloud of believers getting on the first vehicle off this earth. There is something that the rapture doctrine ignores and that is gravity.

69 posted on 01/14/2013 8:02:32 AM PST by Just mythoughts
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To: huldah1776
There are two distinct references to the resurrection of the dead.

Agree, but actually there are three resurrections and one instance of transformation (rapture – from the Greek raptorial, IIRC) of the living in Christ in God’s plan. The actual first resurrection was that of the Messiah along with the elders (the first fruits).

Michael Rood condenses it well in his book I’ve mentioned above, *The Mystery of Iniquity*. I highly recommend it. IMO, Rood will be one of the most important interpreters of scripture of our age.

Excerpt:

SEVEN SEALS: Satan’s authority stripped from heaven; his unbridled power unleashed on earth [The tribulation begins].

SIX TRUMPETS: War devastation that gives the New World Order full control on earth:

SEVEN THUNDERS: Great tribulation and persecution of the believers.

SEVENTH and LAST TRUMPET: The Saints’ (first resurrection) [those in the grave in Christ followed immediately by the living in Christ (the transformation/rapture of the living)].

SEVEN BOWLS OF GOD’S WRATH: The day of vengeance of our God; tribulators tribulated.

ARMAGEDDON: Messiah returns to the earth to rule; Satan bound for 1,000 years.

MILLENIUM: The 1000 year reign of Messiah on earth; saints rule with a rod of iron.

THE END: The last (second) resurrection and final judgment [of all that remain who have ever existed on the earth]; death and the grave destroyed.

ETERNITY:The new heaven, and earth, and the new Jerusalem; God wipes the tears away.

I doubt Rood’s interpretation is 100% accurate, but IMO, one of the most accurate interpretations I’ve seen based on all available scripture; including ancient texts.

70 posted on 01/14/2013 8:18:33 AM PST by Errant
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To: huldah1776

15 For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord, will not precede those who have fallen asleep.]]

Yes, the dead will be raised and taken first- however there is notrhign i nthe word to indicate that Christ rasies the dead-takes them them ascends back itno heaven without thsoe who are alive- the dead goign first could mean only minutes before Christ brings those alive along with Him when He assends back to heaven

[[“THE REST OF THE DEAD DID NOT COME TO LIFE UNTIL THE THOUSAND YEARS ARE COMPLETED.”]]

Be careful here- this is talking about thsoe hwo die DURING the tribulation AFTER the first ressurection- thsi does NOT indicate that Christians who were alive before trib started did not get raptured- ALL the saved dead BEFORE the ressurectio nwere already taken to heaven durign first rapture


78 posted on 01/14/2013 9:08:23 AM PST by CottShop (Scientific belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge)
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