Posted on 06/18/2013 2:34:06 PM PDT by NYer
Prager helped give further opening. If there is something which begs further addition, why wait? Going on about those, who according to you would "wine about weather and wine" is just so much more whining itself, as could be my pointing this out(?)...but it is not I whom in mourning for this one soul...
If there is something needing saying, spit it out. Or what is this? Some melodrama over the guy's carcass?
But it is complex, isn't it? The tendency towards the now disintegration of the West has many aspects, many fault lines upon which there is movement. Where is the immovable rock? It is simple. But to play along with the philosopher who not believing altars belong to but "the people" requires much thought, many hours of writing and editing. Then what? Contribute that sort of essay as "reply"?
Lead on. Until then...whiners Unite! Click glasses and toast one another.
Or we can all search for ways to preach the gospel in ways and languages others not only may understand, but which will have them turn in the only direction that ultimately matters. Some will. It does seem painfully obvious a great many wont. Harvest what is possible. The storm approaches, but for a while yet I do not know for how long...possibly the worst thunderheads will by-pass portions of the wider prairie.
Indeed. A godless pagan desecrates France’s primary altar in a selfish act of narcissism. Talk about losing the plot.
A man is dead and we read all this huffery and puffery. As if this were an opera and the blood not real, nor his view of the Present situation of France.
Lots of people just don’t get Venner. But the left hates him virulently.
Yes, 1914 introduces the concept of 1914 being the start of a 30 years war where the loser was Europe. He doesn’t seem to think much of the USA, USSR or Islam which makes sense in a Euro-centric sort of way.
Sorry I wasn’t clearer in my intent. Yes, I was replying to you -— or, rather, joining in your observation that “People commit suicide every day.” You were the only one in the thread up to that point to state that, so I wanted to chime in on it.
I just can’t see why was the author so upset that this one suicide was not making front-page news. I was agreeing with the point you’d made.
Venner simply sees USA as a separate nation that, as a winner of 1914-45 came to rule West Europe. He notes that the values that mesh in well with American national character, such as commercialism, do not match the European character nearly as well.
We are surprised by this because we are conditioned to think of our system as universal. It is not: it is American national.
Ok, I get it now.
Sometimes when we are posting to many people, the replies get mixed up.....silly humans.
One feature I wish FR had was the ability to go back and edit.
Thanks for explaining. ;-)
Congratulations! Your post is the longest stringing-together of words that have no meaning or objective in the history of mankind.
Meanwhile, tell us how you propose to fix the problem, how to halt then reverse this decline of the West as many here (including myself) perceive that to be occurring.
Like I said, that is complex, isn't it?
I doubt that I'm speaking that far over your head. Why reply from pride? Will that save the day for us?
In regards to those things which led this man to shoot himself at the altar of this famous French church, an altar seemingly one he believed only partially in primary sense as towards fundamental truth, but believed mightily in regarding the place for such altars of renown for past historical influence of European cultural formation; should it be expected that those who are in full backslide mode, the poofters and the rest of the modernists will chose now, since the guy slayed himself at that altar, to listen to anyone's "pride" but their own?
In their own view, it is they themselves who are enlightened. Not the church, nor the man who shot himself inside one of Europe's most noteworthy landmarks of "church". Which is why I said we have to preach the gospel in language (words) they understand...for they have turned their backs on religion itself as antiquated, as being more a product of mankind than place of clarity, and in regards to Judeo-Christianity, the place where truth itself can be found.
How to convince them?
Now that I have explained my own parabolic manner of speech to an extent as to the intent of those words, do you anything further yourself to say, that is not mere insult? If so, then speak on. Spit it out.
My original post was not addressed to you. Your original post was addressed to me. Then, you quote me using words that I never wrote. This is not just bad manners and poor writing, it is a lie.
Your writing is so full of fallacies that it would take up too much time, energy and space to point them out and then repudiate them.
I stand by my original post. The purpose of the story was to draw attention to WHY this obviously educated man killed himself. You trivialize his death and call him a carcass. What a shameful thing to do.
You make my point for me. In a discussion concerning a man’s decision to commit suicide, you go off topic to show us how much you know about a completely different topic. In reasoned discussion, it is expected that you will stick to the topic.
If you want me to save Western Civilization, then read ALL my previous writing here at Free Republic. If you want me to educate you, then I suggest you do some self-examination first.
Venner was a hero of the Algerian war, he has more than paid his dues. His suicide was his way of saying “with me dies the last honorable generation of our countrymen. The rest of you enjoy the multicultural cesspool that you’ve created.”
Gee, even I know.
The mainstream American right? There is no such thing.
There aren't 10 000 well-educated and conformed men of the right in the whole country.
The "mainstream" right is riddled with liberalism, collectivism, and equality-mongering.
Correct. The establishment "right" (i.e. most of the GOP Senate, and every GOP Presidential nominee from GHW Bush on) has largely embraced multiculturalism and liberalism. The Bush/McCain wing of the GOP differs from the Democrats in style, not substance.
Reminds me of an old quote from Churchill where he acknowledges that he’s not a pillar of the church but rather a flying buttress. “I support the Church, but from the outside.”
I’m not sure that we are a single race descended from Adam and Eve. Is that understanding as a result of a literal interpretation of Genesis?
Amen to that.
That matters not one whit on this forum.
Excuse me?
Here's the quote again, addressed to your own comment #19.
Go back and review that (I even provided the link), then tell me that phrase is not found there. You accused me of misquoting you, even lying. Apologize for that, the better for us to move forward.
I chose to focus upon it in particular, for as you reword it in this last "attack response" to my own comments;
Yes, like I said above. I wasn't disputing that. I read the article, briefly scanned through links for a more a than a few provided in this thread, read a few more articles from elsewhere, etc.
Right out of the gate you have already stumbled. I didn't misquote you. Apologize for calling me a liar. If it had been a mistake, I would have owned up to it. Check again for fallacies, conduct some of that self-examination you proscribed for me...
And what topic was that? Preaching the gospel? Or was it the off-hand chiding I delivered about clinking glasses as "toasts" to one selves? That last one left a little dent, did it? Is that what this is all about?
Isn't that much the subject of the thread? That the guy shot himself over what he saw as serious challenge to the continuation of civilization as he knew of such in France in particular? If there are "previous writings of yours" that have the magic formula, it's up to you to bring forth any treasures which may be found there. Since you couldn't remember what you said just the other day...perhaps you should reread them yourself. As for self-examination, take a deep breath, go back over the comments here, see where you have falsely accused me, then go back over the whole thing again and see if we though perhaps not precisely on the same page in all things...might be reading out of adjacent chapters of the same book.
For my own, I don't think I could convince very many lefty losers of the dangers to civilization of their own ways, even by using guy's like Venner, his work as historian, and the reasons for his own taking his life as he did. Though I can see how that may be tempting, perhaps better his story could set among various items of consideration which could be pointed to.
If others can, and convince more than a bare few of the sort who already need little or no further convincing, then go for it. Is that the answer? A new nationalism, a national tribalism aimed against who precisely? But it's not enough to wake many of the rest of them from their stupor, AFAIKT. My own preaching at them too, could be counter-productive at some points. Wise as serpents, yet harmless as doves is a directive that may apply along about here...
Would they repent at the news of his death, once the "saw" why, once they were shown the bigger picture? Would they suddenly realize ---they have been somewhat wrong all along? Or would they simply continue on in their own pride of being the (all things modernist lefty) enlightened ones? But you force me to repeat that question...
For my own part, I do see storm clouds on the horizon. In fact, there are scattered storms right now. Bigger ones to come? Even a clash of civilizations? Or will such clash not occur due to muzzies and faggots taking over the West, leaving us go out with a whimper, and the retrograde force that is Islam spread still further? Is this last the real fear? The fear that those whom are too accommodating will weaken us to point of collapse, or at least to point we will no longer be able to match the "them", war for bloody war?
Meanwhile, I cannot proscribe the cure. But I can preach the gospel, yet realize that using 'church language' can be counter-productive with many, hence my inclusion of recommendation of using words that people can understand, words that won't turn them off...but not at the price of compromising the gospel. If that sort of thing is part of that which you declare so full of fallacies that it would take up too much time, energy and space to point them out and then repudiate them. then spare yourself the effort, for I doubt I would hear a word, even AFTER the apology due was forthcoming...but which I rather suspect will not be.
You sure you're a "tradical" Catholic?
Isn't trasubstantiation a result of a literal interpretation of John 6?
Yep . . . no matter how "tradical," all Catholics have to believe in evolution to prove they don't live in a trailer park. Lol!
Ping to wideawake for his interest.
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