To: Gamecock
The fallen nature of man is Catholic orthodoxy.
Calvin’s novel doctrine or heresy wasn’t about man’s fallen nature - it was the concept of ‘Total Depravity’. This is the idea that man cannot do anything towards his salvation.
Which is simply not true. We have free will. We can choose God. That power of choice is ours alone - it is God’s gift to us. We had it before The Fall, and we retain it still.
Take away that concept - as Calvin sought to - and you get insane and inhuman concepts such as predestination and the denial of free will.
The concept of a universe full of aimless automata plunging towards a fate that they can neither choose nor reject may be a good fit for Modern America (under the increasingly tyrannical rule of the left). However it’s nothing but an insult to free men and to the Founding Fathers of America.
11 posted on
07/04/2013 7:34:14 AM PDT by
agere_contra
(I once saw a movie where only the police and military had guns. It was called 'Schindler's List'.)
To: agere_contra
Total depravity of man and predestination posits that all men are evil and God chose the elect and the reprobates before the earth was created i.e. who is going to heavan and who is going to hell before He created the earth. If you follow the logic Calvinists believe Good happens to Good people i.e. the elect and bad happens to bad people i.e. the reprobates. So if you ever wonder why some quote unquote Conservatives don’t want to address structural problems - they don’t have to worry about them - because God has already decided - the reprobates (they can be recognized by the fact that they have nothing or little) are going to hell anyways - why worry about them here on earth.
To: Gamecock
Total depravity of man and predestination posits that all men are evil and God chose the elect and the reprobates before the earth was created i.e. who is going to heaven and who is going to hell before He created the earth. If you follow the logic Calvinists believe Good happens to Good people i.e. the elect and bad happens to bad people i.e. the reprobates. So if you ever wonder why some quote unquote Conservatives don't want to address structural problems - they don't have to worry about them - because God has already decided - the reprobates (they can be recognized by the fact that they have nothing or little) are going to hell anyways - why worry about them here on earth.
To: agere_contra
That power of choice is ours alone ...Take away that concept - as Calvin sought to - and you get insane and inhuman concepts such as predestination and the denial of free will. Your straw man is coined Hyper-Calvinism.
Calvinism which is also Luther's understanding (read bondage of the will) Augustine's and apostolic see below:
- Ephesians 2:8-9 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves;
- Philippians 2:13 God who works in you both to will and to do for His good pleasure...
- Titus 3:5-7 not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit, whom He poured out on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Savior...
- 2 Timothy 1:8-9 God, who has saved us and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to His own purpose and grace which was given to us in Christ Jesus before time began,...
- Ephesians 2:10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them.
- Ephesians 1:4-5 ... just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before Him in love, having predestined us to adoption as sons by Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will,
It is perplexing that physicists acknowledge light to act as both a particle stream and a wave. The mystery they, without hubris of conceit, observe. Yet pelagians cannot be as humble to look at special revelation and subject their understanding to it alone. Calvinism gives the glory of election to God alone.
18 posted on
07/04/2013 8:18:59 AM PDT by
DaveyB
(Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. -John Adams)
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson