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To: Gamecock

The fallen nature of man is Catholic orthodoxy.

Calvin’s novel doctrine or heresy wasn’t about man’s fallen nature - it was the concept of ‘Total Depravity’. This is the idea that man cannot do anything towards his salvation.

Which is simply not true. We have free will. We can choose God. That power of choice is ours alone - it is God’s gift to us. We had it before The Fall, and we retain it still.

Take away that concept - as Calvin sought to - and you get insane and inhuman concepts such as predestination and the denial of free will.

The concept of a universe full of aimless automata plunging towards a fate that they can neither choose nor reject may be a good fit for Modern America (under the increasingly tyrannical rule of the left). However it’s nothing but an insult to free men and to the Founding Fathers of America.


11 posted on 07/04/2013 7:34:14 AM PDT by agere_contra (I once saw a movie where only the police and military had guns. It was called 'Schindler's List'.)
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To: agere_contra

Total depravity of man and predestination posits that all men are evil and God chose the elect and the reprobates before the earth was created i.e. who is going to heavan and who is going to hell before He created the earth. If you follow the logic Calvinists believe Good happens to Good people i.e. the elect and bad happens to bad people i.e. the reprobates. So if you ever wonder why some quote unquote Conservatives don’t want to address structural problems - they don’t have to worry about them - because God has already decided - the reprobates (they can be recognized by the fact that they have nothing or little) are going to hell anyways - why worry about them here on earth.


13 posted on 07/04/2013 7:59:27 AM PDT by BellaBlackLab (BellaBlackLab)
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To: Gamecock
Total depravity of man and predestination posits that all men are evil and God chose the elect and the reprobates before the earth was created i.e. who is going to heaven and who is going to hell before He created the earth. If you follow the logic Calvinists believe Good happens to Good people i.e. the elect and bad happens to bad people i.e. the reprobates. So if you ever wonder why some quote unquote Conservatives don't want to address structural problems - they don't have to worry about them - because God has already decided - the reprobates (they can be recognized by the fact that they have nothing or little) are going to hell anyways - why worry about them here on earth.
14 posted on 07/04/2013 8:03:26 AM PDT by BellaBlackLab (BellaBlackLab)
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To: agere_contra
That power of choice is ours alone ...Take away that concept - as Calvin sought to - and you get insane and inhuman concepts such as predestination and the denial of free will.

Your straw man is coined Hyper-Calvinism.
Calvinism which is also Luther's understanding (read bondage of the will) Augustine's and apostolic see below:


18 posted on 07/04/2013 8:18:59 AM PDT by DaveyB (Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. -John Adams)
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