Posted on 10/07/2013 2:25:57 PM PDT by NYer
....Or better yet, the full 20 rosary.
It seems that "Catholic in Brooklyn" cherry-picks his material, not unlike some posters on this forum.
Are you talking about the Glow-in-the-Dark mysteries that somebody made up out of whole cloth?
Soon we may have an an Eleventh Commandment or the Ninth Beatitude, such as: Blesssed are the muslims for they resisted those nasty proselytizing Crusaders (including St Francis of Assisi); “May St John the Baptist protect Islam (JPII the Great)”
The luminous mysteries are very wonderful and speaks about the life of Christ and His miracles and teachings. Plus they are a gift from Blessed John Paul II.
The Luminous mysteries are optional. Many traditionalists prefer the 15 decade; it corresponds with the 150 Psalms.
“Jesus Christ said the identifying sign of his followers would be that they would love one another. “By this all people will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.” (John 13:35) If that is the case, then I would suggest the many of those who run Catholic blogs and websites do some real soul searching because you are not displaying a whole lot of loving at the present moment, especially when it comes to our Holy Father, Pope Francis.”
“If that is the case” then by the words of Jesus, vs. 34 included, most of what calls itself “Christian” today fails the test.
Huh. I love this pope. You are so lucky to have him. I think he is the best!!
I suppose it’s a very minor point, but that quote seems to suggest that Pope Francis is sticking with the 15 traditional mysteries of the Rosary, and not saying the additional five suggested by JP II in 2002.I hadn't really thought of that; interesting point. And as a reminder to those who may not have remembered, today is the feast of Our Lady of the Rosary:
On October 7, the Roman Catholic Church celebrates the yearly feast of Our Lady of the Rosary. Known for several centuries by the alternate title of “Our Lady of Victory,” the feast day takes place in honor of a 16th century naval victory which secured Europe against Turkish invasion. Pope St. Pius V attributed the victory to the intercession of the Blessed Virgin Mary, who was invoked on the day of the battle through a campaign to pray the Rosary throughout Europe. LinkOur Lady of the Rosary, please pray for US, and pray for Pope Francis too.
Whereas the Luminous Mysteries correspond to the Gospels. Where's the problem with meditating on the words of Jesus Christ?
When I was commuting to NYC from Vermont, I used to go to Our Lady of Victory Church down near Wall Street, whenever I stayed over the weekend. They didn’t do the Latin Mass, but it was always beautifully done and traditional minded. Good sermons, good music, respect for the Sacrament.
Not gonna get in an argument about it. Christians spend too much time arguing. I was just explaining one reason why some Catholics don’t include the Luminous mysteries.
There’s nothing wrong with the five new mysteries. They are certainly biblical. But there is a long tradition of three groups of five, and they accord with the basic pattern of Jesus’ life: birth, death, and resurrection.
I was an admirer of JP II and his Encyclicals. Still, it seemed to me an odd thing to do. Not wrong, but odd. And I don’t think it has done anything to increase the saying of the Rosary, which probably was his purpose.
No problem, I suppose. You and and the modernist popes can make up new decades every day if you want.
When, in an approved apparition, Mary acknowledges the Luminous Mysteries I will rush to incorporate them.
Unfortunately, I believe you are correct on that.
Of those lay people who say the Rosary, most all of them seem to be
1) Old people (me)
or
2) Family members of the old people
or
3) Young people who just discovered the Tridentine Mass (or maybe other Rites, also?)
or
4) People who were chatechized in a very traditional and orthodox environment
(such as the Religious Education coordinator we have now who grew up in the Phillipines).
Meanwhile, back to the Glow-in-Dark Mysteries:
Freep-mail me to get on or off my pro-life and Catholic List:
Please ping me to note-worthy Pro-Life or Catholic threads, or other threads of general interest.
I was an admirer of JP II and his Encyclicals. Still, it seemed to me an odd thing to do. Not wrong, but odd. And I don’t think it has done anything to increase the saying of the Rosary, which probably was his purpose.
I must tell you I have long been amused by these added mysteries. The Rosary is a private devotion and as such is not binding on anyone at all in the first place. Secondly, as it is not a public liturgical rite anyone can do with it what they will, adding prayers and removing them, and changing the mysteries. Pope JPII decided, regardless of all of this, to promulgate his suggestions for new mysteries for those who chose to use them, obviously these being entirely optional. How do people react to a completely optional suggestion by a pope regarding a private unbinding devotion? They acted like it was a new tablet of Moses straight from the mountain top! They rushed out and changed every prayer book. Every Church which prayed the Rosary before or after Masses, or at other times, immediately changed theirs to include these new optional mysteries. I was even told on a pseudo-catholic forum, one which claims to offer Answers of a Catholic nature, that I was being "disobedient" to a pope when I said I didn't personally like them. How exactly do you disobey an optional suggested addition to a private devotion? Hmmmm.
But, what really made me laugh was how these same people who reacted this way to the optional suggested additions to private devotions then ignored everything the popes said that did impact public prayer or life in the Church. Did they pay any attention to the statements about abuse of extraordinary ministers of Holy Communion? Nope, ignored it. How did they react to comments about Latin in the Mass, or music in the Mass or anything else in the Mass? Crickets, just crickets. Bring it up and you would get some vague thing about infallibility and ex cathedra statements. But those optional suggested additions to the private unbinding devotion? "The pope gave those to us, and we should listen to him!" Oh boy.
All I know is I don’t have to believe or obey anything Pope Francis says, unless he is speaking Ex Cathedra.
Not true. You have to obey the pope regardless, and give what is called religious assent, obsequium religiosum, to the pope in all matters of faith regardless of any hint of infallibility.
When he speaks to the universal Church.
The relevant section of the Vatican II Document Lumen Gentium (excerpted from LG 25):
This religious submission of mind and will must be shown in a special way to the authentic magisterium of the Roman Pontiff, even when he is not speaking ex cathedra; that is, it must be shown in such a way that his supreme magisterium is acknowledged with reverence, the judgments made by him are sincerely adhered to, according to his manifest mind and will. His mind and will in the matter may be known either from the character of the documents, from his frequent repetition of the same doctrine, or from his manner of speaking.
For context, feel free to read the whole thing: http://www.vatican.va/archive/hist_councils/ii_vatican_council/documents/vat-ii_const_19641121_lumen-gentium_en.html
If it shows up in the AAS, there is a need to start paying attention. This is the official means of communicating official things, and if the Pope wants religious assent on the point, that is the way to go about it. If he wants people to think and so opts to say thought provoking things in unofficial forums, that is a means of evangelizing but there is not a need to hang on every word (thankfully—I teach theology and have five kids, so I don’t have the time to digest 10,000 words of Papal stuff every week).
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