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To: sr4402

“So then, brethren, stand firm and hold to the traditions which you were taught, whether by word of mouth or by letter from us.” - 2 Thessalonians 2:15 (NASB)

Obviously, there has always been a Tradition separate from Scripture, as evidenced by Scripture itself.


17 posted on 10/18/2013 12:35:49 AM PDT by matthewrobertolson
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To: matthewrobertolson
Obviously, there has always been a Tradition separate from Scripture,

Ah the weasel words expected. Let's short circuit this real quick.

I will ask you what men can be trusted for "Tradition" and you will say the church fathers and the popes and I will ask how many are these men are these and you will say many and that I should trust all these men.

Then I look at Christ's words not to trust in men, but to Trust and put my faith in Him alone.

For with men, there are thousands of views, all attempting to bend things their own way. But Christ alone stands above them, clear pure and bright. He alone is pure, and the Apostle Peter was right "You alone have the words that give eternal life".

Men do not have this. Instead they provide a snare. Like an Octopus of opinions, once you let an arm grab you, they have you.

Trust in Christ Alone and not upon the Traditions of Men, nor the weasel words "Sacred Tradition", for "Sacred Tradition" is still being written according to your tradition as you well know.

And one written years ago is that Mary has "All Salvation". Therefore I must not put my trust in Men, but follow Christ and His Word alone.

I urge you to do the same, and turn from the Traditions of Men and follow upon Christ Alone as a Disciple of His.

The arguments against the Five points and the arguments seen in your posts all argue for the "Traditions" of men IMHO and avoid the scriptures as much as possible. Therefore I urge folks not to trust such arguments because they lead folks away from Christ to put their trust in men.

19 posted on 10/18/2013 12:57:49 AM PDT by sr4402
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To: matthewrobertolson; sr4402; All

“Obviously, there has always been a Tradition separate from Scripture, as evidenced by Scripture itself.”


This kind of argument would be what Cyril would call “mere plausibility and artifices of speech.” The obvious reply is, what proof do you have that the completed scripture does not contain the fullness of truth? Why wouldn’t the Apostles, writing under the inspiration of the Spirit, record all the things necessary to know for salvation, but leave stuff out, like Mary being required for salvation, thus allowing for schism when this human authority is questioned? After all, “It is better to trust in the LORD than to put confidence in man” (Psa 118:8).

Hence such heresy as a denial of the sole authority of the word of God gives rise to different claimants of divine authority, from the RCC to its various Popes reinterpreting Catholic teaching from one generation to another, to the Eastern Orthodox, the other guys who claim to be the one true church of God on Earth, who conclude that the Catholic church is apostate. Mind you, I cannot complain. I agree with them, at least on that point.


20 posted on 10/18/2013 12:59:57 AM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans (If anyone tells you it's a cookbook, don't believe them.)
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To: matthewrobertolson
Obviously, there has always been a Tradition separate from Scripture, as evidenced by Scripture itself.

This is the tradition you seek:

John 17:

13 But now I come to You; and these things I speak in the world so that they may have My joy made full in themselves. 14 I have given them Your word; and the world has hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.

15 I do not ask You to take them out of the world, but to keep them from the evil one. 16 They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world. 17 Sanctify them in the truth; Your word is truth. 18 As You sent Me into the world, I also have sent them into the world. 19 For their sakes I sanctify Myself, that they themselves also may be sanctified in truth.

20 “I do not ask on behalf of these alone, but for those also who believe in Me through their word; 21 that they may all be one; even as You, Father, are in Me and I in You, that they also may be in Us, so that the world may believe that You sent Me.

39 posted on 10/18/2013 12:59:50 PM PDT by redleghunter
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